Episode 34 -From Survival to Advocacy: Tracy Clark and Erica Young on Combating Domestic Violence in Indiana

Transcript

WEBVTT

00:00:05.347 --> 00:00:21.129
there's tons of types of domestic violence, from financial abuse to sexual abuse, to verbal abuse as well we've heard from survivors that have said you know, they would rather stay in the relationship because they don't have anywhere to go and shelter.

00:00:21.129 --> 00:00:23.003
They do not want to put their children through that.

00:00:30.000 --> 00:00:37.429
Some family and friends think that they need to jump in, they need to save, they need to pull you out of the situation and, unfortunately for most of our survivors, we've noticed that actually pushes them further into the situation.

00:00:40.119 --> 00:00:45.292
Believe what they tell you and respect their experiences and listen to their experiences.

00:00:45.292 --> 00:00:47.908
We have a lot to learn from survivors.

00:00:50.540 --> 00:00:58.024
One of the biggest challenges that we're facing is the growing domestic violence crisis that we have here in the state of Indiana.

00:00:58.024 --> 00:01:11.120
It's worse here than any other state state.

00:01:11.159 --> 00:01:17.224
Welcome to Homeward Indy, a bi-weekly conversation where we meet the people working to end homelessness in Indianapolis and hear their stories.

00:01:17.224 --> 00:01:29.052
I'm Elliott Zanz and I'm Steve Barnhart.

00:01:29.052 --> 00:01:40.962
This is a friendly reminder that the views and opinions expressed in this program are those of the speakers and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions of any entities they belong to or represent.

00:01:40.962 --> 00:01:46.132
Hello Homeward Indie listeners.

00:01:46.132 --> 00:01:47.896
This is Elliot Zanz.

00:01:47.896 --> 00:01:50.483
We have an exciting episode today.

00:01:50.483 --> 00:01:56.746
We have two guests from different organizations, which is a first, and also I'm leading the interview process, which is also a first.

00:01:56.746 --> 00:01:58.992
So it should be a fun time.

00:01:58.992 --> 00:02:01.081
Amazing guests.

00:02:01.081 --> 00:02:07.751
Do you want to introduce yourselves and talk about briefly about like your roles and your organizations, so everyone knows who is speaking?

00:02:08.240 --> 00:02:09.903
Absolutely so.

00:02:09.903 --> 00:02:10.806
I'm Tracy Clark.

00:02:10.806 --> 00:02:13.853
I am the Director of Supportive Services at Coburn Place.

00:02:13.853 --> 00:02:17.766
Newer to that role, I joined in with Coburn Place in October.

00:02:17.766 --> 00:02:25.526
But I was actually on their board for several years before I joined in to the Coburn Place staff, so I'm excited about that.

00:02:25.526 --> 00:02:28.125
That was not my first connection with Coburn Place.

00:02:28.125 --> 00:02:37.682
I actually connected with Coburn Place as a resident and a survivor several years ago, so I was a resident there, which really connects with the survivors.

00:02:37.682 --> 00:02:47.133
A little bit about Coburn Place For those who don't know we offer compassionate services as well as safe housing choices for survivors of domestic violence and their children.

00:02:47.133 --> 00:02:52.752
We offer up to two years no rent, no utilities and a host of services to help them heal.

00:02:53.741 --> 00:02:54.603
That's fantastic.

00:02:54.603 --> 00:02:55.866
Thank you so much, Tracy.

00:02:55.866 --> 00:02:58.192
I'm so excited you're here representing Coburn.

00:02:58.192 --> 00:03:00.566
We know you all do incredible work for our community.

00:03:02.250 --> 00:03:09.763
Fantastic Thank you community Fantastic, thank you.

00:03:09.763 --> 00:03:09.823
Hi.

00:03:09.823 --> 00:03:10.183
I'm Erica Young.

00:03:10.183 --> 00:03:13.293
I am the housing program coordinator with the Indiana Coalition Against Domestic Violence, or ICADV.

00:03:13.293 --> 00:03:16.701
I've been with ICADV for a little over four years.

00:03:16.701 --> 00:03:21.992
I work on expanding housing opportunities for survivors of domestic violence.

00:03:21.992 --> 00:03:36.506
Prior to joining ICADV, I was with the Indiana Housing and Community Development Authority where I oversaw grant programs specifically for continuum of care in the Balance Estate.

00:03:36.506 --> 00:03:40.542
Really excited to be here today and really excited to join Coburn Place.

00:03:40.542 --> 00:03:41.804
They're one of our member programs.

00:03:41.804 --> 00:03:45.813
At ICADV, we are the statewide umbrella organization.

00:03:45.813 --> 00:03:50.331
We provide training and technical assistance to our member programs throughout the state.

00:03:50.331 --> 00:03:54.289
We do a lot of other things too, but I'll leave it at that for the sake of time.

00:03:54.819 --> 00:03:55.360
Amazing.

00:03:55.360 --> 00:03:56.200
Thank you so much.

00:03:56.200 --> 00:04:19.701
I'm so excited to have a statewide organization here as well as one like more local to the Marion County, indianapolis continuum of care, because that's also a fun and unique perspective and you have perspective perspective on balance of state, which is the continuum of care for the rest of Indiana, and that's also wonderful and I'm excited to hear your thoughts about that.

00:04:19.701 --> 00:04:51.773
So I guess this is a good opportunity to just share more deeply about, like the work you do, your population you serve, unique challenges faced by that population and anything else you want to share and just say that one of the biggest challenges that we're facing is the increasingly growing domestic violence crisis that we have here in the state of Indiana.

00:04:51.913 --> 00:04:54.083
It's worse here than any other state.

00:04:54.403 --> 00:04:58.432
The pandemic made it worse and it continues to increasingly get worse.

00:04:58.432 --> 00:05:12.415
So the fact that we are unable to serve everyone that is going through this challenge and that there continues to be a lot of people that are on list and waiting and trying to get into safe places.

00:05:12.415 --> 00:05:15.029
But we only can hold so many people.

00:05:15.029 --> 00:05:17.339
We have 35 units on site.

00:05:17.339 --> 00:05:26.790
They're fully furnished apartments, they're their own units, they're a lease in their name where they're able to get that history and have that rental history as well, but it's only 35 units.

00:05:26.970 --> 00:05:32.771
Yeah, we have an offsite as well, but then we have the housing crisis and things like that.

00:05:32.771 --> 00:05:37.831
So that's our biggest challenge is that the problem is bigger than us and we really just want to.

00:05:37.831 --> 00:05:48.603
That's one of the reasons why we've partnered with so many organizations to try to come together and support and increase the impact in homelessness in the domestic violence community.

00:05:49.045 --> 00:05:49.526
Thank you.

00:05:49.526 --> 00:05:55.425
Can you elaborate a little bit about some of the contributing factors to the increasing issue?

00:05:55.425 --> 00:06:03.814
We know there's a lot to unpack, but just some of the details that are influencing the pandemic was a big contributing factor.

00:06:03.875 --> 00:06:14.333
As far removed or somewhat removed we are from that um, we anticipated originally mistakenly that the that it would go down, that the domestic violence would go down during that time.

00:06:14.333 --> 00:06:18.266
But what we found is people were not connected to the resources they needed.

00:06:18.266 --> 00:06:22.024
Some people did not have the coping skills to be at home with their spouse.

00:06:22.024 --> 00:06:25.961
Some spouses were now home longer and not going into work.

00:06:25.961 --> 00:06:28.786
So that increased it and continue to increase it.

00:06:28.786 --> 00:06:39.444
We have found that currently here in Indiana or Indianapolis, the zip codes that have the lower income are tied to the ones that have more domestic violence cases as well.

00:06:39.444 --> 00:07:20.093
We found that self-sufficiency and financial abuse is a big factor in the domestic violence homeless community, because a lot of times the individuals and the survivors of domestic violence don't have access to any of the income or to any of the bank accounts or anything of that nature, and that puts them in a position where they're more likely to go into homelessness yeah, absolutely, thank you for providing that really important context.

00:07:20.112 --> 00:07:21.194
21 in Indiana.

00:07:21.194 --> 00:07:23.915
So that is a large increase.

00:07:23.915 --> 00:07:27.422
Especially with the pandemic that was a contributing factor.

00:07:27.422 --> 00:07:29.725
But we can.

00:07:29.725 --> 00:07:34.822
We continue to see that safe, stable and affordable housing is the number one need for survivors.

00:07:34.822 --> 00:07:45.649
I know that's for a lot of people throughout the state but survivors specifically, and then all of the things that come along with survivors leaving an abusive relationship.

00:07:45.649 --> 00:07:54.350
So housing is the number one need, but all of those other supports that go along, such as the supports that Coburn provides within their programs, are so important.

00:07:54.350 --> 00:08:14.310
We know that lethality increases as a survivor leaves and making sure that access to those support services and housing, you know, stay at the top for survivors yeah, will you define lethality for our audience, like, I mean, it seems kind of obvious, but also yeah, yeah, so it becomes more dangerous.

00:08:14.370 --> 00:08:30.047
When an individual leaves A lot of times, an abuser or a person causing harm feels like they're losing that control, so it increases the lethality, meaning that it could result in homicide Trigger warning there.

00:08:30.187 --> 00:08:35.263
Sorry, I didn't realize Indiana was the worst of the states right now.

00:08:35.263 --> 00:08:44.865
But also I'm not terribly surprised and it makes a lot of sense that it's tied to resource access and we're talking about income like translate that in your minds to access to resources.

00:08:44.865 --> 00:08:51.591
Money in our society is resource access and when we're reframing it that way, I think it's helpful for people to think about.

00:08:51.591 --> 00:08:59.306
Yes, everyone deserves access to basic resources and the ability to be safe and stably housed, and housing is obviously health care.

00:08:59.306 --> 00:09:00.249
Housing is safety.

00:09:00.249 --> 00:09:07.211
Housing is stability for your kids and yourself and healing Like it's everything Housing can be and healing it's everything truly Housing can be homicide reduction.

00:09:07.480 --> 00:09:08.886
Housing can be homicide reduction.

00:09:08.886 --> 00:09:12.024
Thank you for that.

00:09:12.024 --> 00:09:17.142
What are some myths?

00:09:17.142 --> 00:09:30.488
I know there's a lot of like myths around domestic violence and there's the always the narrative of why don't they just leave, which is something that is frustrating to hear and also needs to always be unpacked and reframed for folks.

00:09:30.488 --> 00:09:40.866
Do you both want to speak to some of the myths that you hear, or even from survivors, as they're trying to get out of a situation that might help folks to understand better?

00:09:41.369 --> 00:09:42.230
Yes, absolutely.

00:09:42.230 --> 00:09:53.633
Number one thing that I realized as a survivor of domestic violence that I didn't know before I got into Cobra Place is that most survivors leave multiple times before they actually leave for good.

00:09:53.633 --> 00:10:05.128
I think the average is two or three times that they leave before they leave for good, and that information is something that stands out to me and it's vital to me because I felt so bad about that.

00:10:05.128 --> 00:10:15.761
It was my second time leaving and I had left before and fortunately I had a family member that I went to two times and she did not have any.

00:10:15.761 --> 00:10:36.777
She invited me with open arms the second time, just as much as she did the first time when I went into homelessness, and that was so important because one of the big I don't know if I would say it would be a myth, but one of the biggest challenges for survivors of domestic violence while they're going through it is getting the right support from their family and friends.

00:10:37.360 --> 00:10:48.806
Some family and friends think that they need to jump in, they need to save, they need to pull you out of the situation and unfortunately for most of our survivors we've noticed that actually pushes them further into the situation.

00:10:48.806 --> 00:10:54.892
So it's a very gentle balance when it comes to offering that support in that space whenever they're ready.

00:10:54.892 --> 00:11:10.902
In that situation, with my cousin, it was literally that she was like well, whenever, if you need to leave again or something happens, support you going back, but if something happens, you need to leave again, just call me up, I'm gonna call away.

00:11:10.902 --> 00:11:13.027
Yeah, and it was that gentle opening that allowed me to get there and then to get to Copern Place.

00:11:13.047 --> 00:11:18.909
Yeah, and the unconditional regard of you don't need to meet my standards for me to help you feels really critical.

00:11:19.312 --> 00:11:35.850
Absolutely Another big myth that I learned once I was inside of Coburn Place and the reason I went into nonprofit support because right after I left Coburn Place as a resident I went on to support several minority ran nonprofits and help them to get started and succeed as nonprofit organizations.

00:11:35.850 --> 00:11:37.860
Over 4000 organizations, wow.

00:11:37.860 --> 00:11:45.504
And the reason that I did that was because I noticed a disdain or a vibe towards some of their survivors by some of the staff.

00:11:45.543 --> 00:11:56.798
Sometimes that just wasn't aware and this was years ago we have all new staff, but what I noticed was that people would make assumptions.

00:11:56.798 --> 00:11:59.640
They would make assumptions that there was lack of education.

00:11:59.640 --> 00:12:03.904
They would make assumptions that survivors were abusing the system.

00:12:03.904 --> 00:12:10.769
They would make assumptions that, financially, survivors did not have access to finances.

00:12:10.809 --> 00:12:31.806
In the past situation, I had done a lot in business, a lot in entrepreneurship and, unfortunately, but very common I did not recognize the signs of an abuser because I grew up in an abusive family as well.

00:12:31.866 --> 00:12:38.726
My father was also abusive to my mother, which is something that we recognize as providers of domestic violence services.

00:12:38.746 --> 00:12:40.850
That that's common, that generational cycle.

00:12:40.850 --> 00:12:51.246
And so, though I had succeeded in life in some other ways, I had not succeeded in being able to identify an abuser and identify when something was abuse.

00:12:51.246 --> 00:13:13.230
And so, though I was at Coburn Place, and though I had been financially abused and abused in many other ways, I still knew what it looked like to have a home, to have a business, to have a, and I started to notice that some people treated you differently, as if there was something missing in your background, in your education, in your relationship skills.

00:13:13.230 --> 00:13:30.715
And it might just be part also of survivors being hyper vigilant about how people see them, because you know it's an embarrassing thing at first to go through In some type of way we also, of course, we tell our survivors there's nothing to be embarrassed about, you didn't do anything wrong in this.

00:13:30.715 --> 00:13:40.105
It still feels like there's some type of lack of success or failure that you went through by being in this relationship, especially when children are involved as well.

00:13:40.407 --> 00:13:42.631
Yeah, absolutely Thank you for talking about that.

00:13:42.631 --> 00:14:06.721
That's so hard to get beyond, and especially when it is very common in our society and this applies to homelessness as well and I think it's a distancing mechanism of like that couldn't happen to me, that that person must, like you know, that person must have all these like lack of resources or be a particular type of person, or all of these like harmful things we tell ourselves, because we don't want to realize that, yeah, it could actually happen to you.

00:14:06.721 --> 00:14:14.306
Homelessness and domestic violence can happen to anybody, and it's a horrifying thing to kind of confront, because then you have to do something about it.

00:14:14.306 --> 00:14:19.666
Absolutely, um, so, yeah, thank you so much for sharing that, because that's so critical.

00:14:20.687 --> 00:14:29.822
I think you know that when we think about why don't you just leave or why don't they just leave, there's that's really complex and we have to think about.

00:14:29.822 --> 00:14:37.102
You know, the there's a lot of fear of you know, when you are with the person causing harm, that you know what's next.

00:14:37.102 --> 00:14:39.966
Right, you, you kind of, can anticipate what's next when you leave.

00:14:39.966 --> 00:14:46.254
You don't know what's next and that can be really scary and the violence can escalate.

00:14:46.254 --> 00:14:50.889
And it's also that fear, I think, of not knowing where you're going to go.

00:14:50.889 --> 00:14:54.440
Shelter is not the best option for all survivors.

00:14:54.440 --> 00:14:57.846
It does work for some, but it doesn't work for all.

00:14:57.846 --> 00:15:07.967
There are, we've heard from survivors that have said, you know, they would rather stay in the relationship because they don't have anywhere to go and shelter, they do not want to put their children through that.

00:15:07.967 --> 00:15:22.342
Or there's also, you know, individuals, survivors that stay because you know the fear of co-parenting, the fear of possibly losing you know their children, of possibly losing you know their children.

00:15:22.342 --> 00:15:27.104
There's all of these things I think that we don't really think about when we hear people say why don't they just leave or they should just leave.

00:15:27.104 --> 00:15:28.847
It's not that simple.

00:15:28.847 --> 00:15:37.046
There's also the you know, lack of access to financial resources, absolutely All of the other barriers to housing.

00:15:37.046 --> 00:15:45.184
There could be criminal records involved, eviction history, all of those things that we don't think about when we say just leave.

00:15:47.629 --> 00:15:52.986
And then, of course I think I touched on this earlier with the you know, shelter not being the only option.

00:15:52.986 --> 00:15:57.649
I know, tracy, you had mentioned the support from your family, which was so important.

00:15:57.649 --> 00:16:09.945
Not all survivors have that support and they might have had that support the first time they left or the second time or the third, but maybe they have run out of that support or that support is no longer there for them.

00:16:09.945 --> 00:16:12.409
So they do fear that judgment.

00:16:12.409 --> 00:16:13.432
You know this.

00:16:13.653 --> 00:16:20.432
Here it is again, I'm leaving again and I'm calling on the support that may not be there that time.

00:16:20.432 --> 00:16:59.750
So I think that there are so many reasons that survivors stay and in the report that ICADV released in 2019, it was the recentering report, it was two and a half years of extensive research that was done, that listened to survivors, and the top identified need by survivors was safe, stable and affordable housing, and there was mention in there that, you know shelter was not an option for them, and I think that that speaks volumes right, because we think just pack your stuff up in the middle of the night, go to a shelter and everything will fall into place from there.

00:16:59.750 --> 00:17:00.802
And that's not the case.

00:17:01.101 --> 00:17:16.340
No, and our shelters are so overstretched there's not room at so many places we do not have, as you've already said, we don't have places for people to go in our system, and I think there's this kind of sense of oh, surely there are services, there are things like there are, but they are limited.

00:17:16.340 --> 00:17:20.365
They are very resource limited and also not always safe themselves.

00:17:20.365 --> 00:17:29.215
It's their own new world of risk that you open yourself up to and, as you mentioned, if you have kids, the risk of losing your kids for being unsheltered is very high.

00:17:34.319 --> 00:17:36.022
And so like those are all really critical things to be aware of.

00:17:36.042 --> 00:18:03.544
And I think there's also this misconception that when individuals flee domestic violence, that someone is after them and so when they go to a shelter they have to go to a specialized shelter right, the services are very important, just like what Coburn provides, but I don't think that there's always enough support for individuals who may need to leave the home because of abuse but continue to have some sort of a relationship with the person causing harm.

00:18:04.224 --> 00:18:14.867
I think that's really important to note, because what we see in movies and TV shows is, you know, someone is after them and they're cutting all contact completely with that individual, and that's not always the case.

00:18:14.867 --> 00:18:19.085
It could be that these two individuals cannot be in the same home together.

00:18:19.085 --> 00:18:33.101
So I think that's something to shed some light on, because we often will receive, you know, calls or here in the community like we are not equipped to handle domestic violence survivors and I have to always ask what does that mean?

00:18:33.101 --> 00:18:57.246
And they think their facility is not locked down enough or they don't have, you know, the electric fences keeping people out, and that's not really what a domestic violence shelter looks like, and I think that our Indianapolis partners could could confirm that that when you're driving by local shelters it doesn't look much different than your traditional homeless shelter.

00:18:57.246 --> 00:19:08.834
So, thinking about you know, yes, the needs are different, but in sheltering situations it's not like it is in the movies or the TV shows.

00:19:09.496 --> 00:19:13.223
Absolutely yes, because many times you're dealing with children.

00:19:13.223 --> 00:19:21.546
You know we have about half 55% of our survivors come with their children and a lot of times there are children from the abusers.

00:19:21.546 --> 00:19:28.144
So there is some type of relationship and court coordination and things like that that they have to work through as well.

00:19:28.144 --> 00:19:35.809
I think another reason why it's hard for survivors to leave at first is because most of the time, threats are involved during that time.

00:19:35.809 --> 00:19:52.088
If you ever leave xyz, and when someone is threatening and you're also experiencing financial abuse that's the biggest threat in the world You're like oh man, I don't have any money and you know they can do this, they have the resources to do this, you know.

00:19:52.088 --> 00:19:54.839
So I think that's one of the biggest challenges as well.

00:19:54.920 --> 00:20:02.512
But I always tell survivors when I get the opportunity to speak with them, if they are not out of the situation, that safety planning is huge.

00:20:02.614 --> 00:20:16.070
Having a plan and trying to start to plan, you know, put something aside and plan getting out, but at the same time, your intuition is just as important and sometimes, like in my situation the moment I left, it was not part of my safety plan.

00:20:16.070 --> 00:20:20.489
I had planned, but at that very moment I was like I cannot go back home.

00:20:20.489 --> 00:20:22.442
Something's telling me this is not the day.

00:20:22.442 --> 00:20:25.634
I was at the YMCA and I had my little one.

00:20:25.634 --> 00:20:56.765
That was one of my safe places because they had childcare there and I could get my thoughts together, and I had had a conversation with my abuser and something in me told me this is, this conversation is so heated, this might be the last time if you go home and I just didn't with nothing, and so that's one of the reasons why I absolutely love the fact that Coburn Place provides the apartments that are fully furnished and their pantries are stocked, because sometimes people are leaving with literally what they have on their back.

00:20:57.444 --> 00:21:00.068
Yes, so that's.

00:21:00.068 --> 00:21:06.163
Yeah, I think that's so important and so good for Coburn to have that resource there.

00:21:06.163 --> 00:21:11.284
Yeah, because when you, when you have to leave, you have to leave and you knew and that was good and I'm so glad you did.

00:21:11.284 --> 00:21:22.050
Um, that's terrifying to be in and to have to make that call and like leap into the unknown, truly it is, it really is, it's a faith, it's really.

00:21:22.131 --> 00:21:31.962
It's like and that was the you actually just brought me back to that moment of that's what the thought was that I didn't know, but I refuse to live in fear.

00:21:31.962 --> 00:21:46.617
I was like if, if it doesn't go well, I'm still it's worth that, because I refuse to live in fear of what would happen next yeah, and that assertion was really powerful and critical and probably saved you.

00:21:46.877 --> 00:21:48.400
Yes, absolutely Did save you.

00:21:48.400 --> 00:21:50.584
Absolutely, you did save you.

00:21:50.584 --> 00:21:55.634
That is, can we talk a little bit?

00:21:55.634 --> 00:22:05.423
I want to talk more about like the state versus this, your Erica's state kind of overseeing agency situation, but first I'd really like to just hear a little bit about what.

00:22:05.423 --> 00:22:10.704
Could you tell listeners about how to support a loved one going through a domestic violence situation?

00:22:10.704 --> 00:22:17.211
What are just like the most important things to keep in mind as they're trying to show up for somebody in a good way?

00:22:17.894 --> 00:22:23.431
Yeah, one of the things that I would add for that is, most importantly, identify resources.

00:22:23.431 --> 00:22:31.420
If you can identify resources for your loved one, that's amazing, because there's one of my loved ones identified the resource of Coburn Place for me.

00:22:31.420 --> 00:22:38.400
I did not know Coburn Place existed when I was fleeing, so it was really like I have no idea what's going on after this.

00:22:38.400 --> 00:22:44.477
And one of my loved ones identified that Coburn Place existed and that that's a place that you know that would be a good place for me.

00:22:44.477 --> 00:22:48.212
So identifying and being aware of resources is important.

00:22:48.212 --> 00:23:24.797
Another resource that I did was not aware of is that if you get some type of eviction or something like that, if you had something put in your name which is something that happens very often with abusers so that you can't go forward and get your own place there are laws I want to say it's VAWA, you'll probably be able to help with that portion, but there are laws that will actually get that off of your history and a lot of people don't recognize that that if you, that each of these apartments are aware of the laws, that you don't have to have that eviction on your history, because those are things that that women and men who are going through abuse get concerned about and those are reasons why they won't leave.

00:23:24.797 --> 00:23:28.012
Get concerned about and those are reasons why they won't leave.

00:23:28.032 --> 00:23:32.262
Yeah, biggest way to support, though, is really just offering that you are ready when that survivor is ready.

00:23:32.262 --> 00:23:33.767
A big thing.

00:23:33.767 --> 00:23:38.721
That kind of aligns with the way that a person should support, and the way that Coburn supports is.

00:23:38.721 --> 00:23:46.500
All of Coburn services are voluntary If a survivor wants to come and stay in their apartment for two years.

00:23:46.500 --> 00:23:50.425
Of course, we hope they don't do that, but they can do that.

00:23:50.425 --> 00:24:29.422
We don't want to represent any going through something hurtful and something that could risk their life, but trying their best to remember that this person is the expert at their life and offer their support without having it as controlling, without trying to control them to come out of the situation, because you're really just mimicking exactly what their abuser has been doing.

00:24:29.663 --> 00:24:34.212
Yeah, and I think the space to make mistakes in that and not have an.

00:24:34.212 --> 00:24:34.954
I told you so.

00:24:34.954 --> 00:24:41.297
I had a situation with a friend who was fleeing once and I was like you should really cut your bank account off.

00:24:41.297 --> 00:24:51.518
You should really cut your bank account off, and they, she wasn't ready and couldn't and all the money got taken and it was a bad day, um, but we were still able to help.

00:24:51.518 --> 00:25:10.093
It was just like you have to know there's gonna be, it's gonna be hard and it's not gonna feel logical to someone trying to come in and help, not in immersed in the danger, uh, and you just have to be like, okay, like it, like here's, I would suggest, but like you can't, you can't control, yeah, it's not going to help.

00:25:10.093 --> 00:25:11.173
To replicate that.

00:25:11.173 --> 00:25:12.693
Absolutely, absolutely.

00:25:12.693 --> 00:25:18.718
Thank you for calling that out.

00:25:19.439 --> 00:25:25.482
The main thing is supporting that individual that's going through it.

00:25:25.482 --> 00:25:31.926
I echo everything that Tracy said, specifically around letting the survivor drive.

00:25:31.926 --> 00:25:42.063
Let them make their own decisions, and making sure you're trying to listen without judgment, because we all think we know what we would do until we're in that situation.

00:25:42.410 --> 00:25:44.998
So, thinking we have all of the answers.

00:25:44.998 --> 00:25:49.614
We don't, and the experiences of survivors are so different.

00:25:49.614 --> 00:26:21.122
What you know Tracy has shared today may be completely different than you know another survivor, and so we don't always have the right answers providing those resources and letting them make the call when they want to reach out to those resources, if they do want to reach out to those resources, I had heard something on a training last week that really stuck with me and that is letting the survivor be in the driver's seat while you are helping with the tunes and the snacks, and that really sat with me.

00:26:22.191 --> 00:26:23.855
Yeah because I think that's so important.

00:26:23.855 --> 00:26:25.820
Right, those are two key pieces.

00:26:25.820 --> 00:26:30.393
I mean, on a road trip, somebody has to drive and somebody has to have the tunes and snacks.

00:26:30.393 --> 00:26:34.797
So be that person with the tunes and snacks and let the survivor decide the way.

00:26:34.797 --> 00:26:37.898
So that would be be.

00:26:37.898 --> 00:26:51.449
My advice is just to make sure that you're you're offering that support, but you're also recognizing that, even if you have gone through something similar, that the solution that you found may not be the solution that they find.

00:26:52.130 --> 00:27:29.733
Absolutely, and I'll just add to that kind of, on the opposite end, making sure that you are aware of the different types of domestic violence, because some people still think that only physical domestic violence is domestic violence, and there's tons of types of domestic violence, from financial abuse to sexual abuse, to verbal abuse as well, and so it's so important for our whole community to be aware, because we have also had survivors where they go to loved ones and they're like, oh, that's OK, that's normal, that's what I grew up with as well, because it's something that they don't understand themselves.

00:27:29.733 --> 00:27:50.446
So it's important for you to understand you know, to be educated on domestic violence and understand all the different types of ways that abuse shows up, because maybe you'll have the opportunity to catch something early for one of your, one of your family members who's going through through something like this, because we have noticed that domestic violence tends to escalate.

00:27:50.446 --> 00:27:55.585
So you'll start on this level and then take a little step higher and a little step higher.

00:27:55.585 --> 00:28:01.730
So that would be another piece of advice I would give yeah, that's really good and emotional abuse is so huge and we also

00:28:01.829 --> 00:28:22.141
see it a lot with young adult, youth and young adults, um, especially like queer youth and young adults, who go through a lot of emotional abuse from family and then they think that when, when you're, when, that's what you grow up in, it creates a familiarity and it's like, oh, this feels familiar, I understand how to navigate in this situation, even if it's not a positive situation.

00:28:22.141 --> 00:28:29.713
Uh, and that makes it feel more comfortable if other people are doing it and lets it go longer, absolutely, and spiritual abuse.

00:28:30.015 --> 00:28:32.020
That was huge.

00:28:32.020 --> 00:28:46.762
That was huge in my abusive situation and huge for me growing up, because so many people use spirituality and church submission and some of those types of things to help themselves to be able to be an abuser as well.

00:28:46.762 --> 00:28:55.547
My abuser was very, very prominent in the church and that was another fear tactic for me as well, you know.

00:28:55.686 --> 00:29:08.019
And then like the community threat of that of someone who has good standing in the community which is also very common, who is an abuser and uses that like, oh, no one's going to believe you, they're going to believe me, absolutely.

00:29:08.380 --> 00:29:11.664
I don't know if I can make this plug here, but I'm going to.

00:29:11.664 --> 00:29:12.932
You can edit it out if needed.

00:29:12.932 --> 00:29:23.279
But the Indiana Coalition Against Domestic Violence did release a stigma campaign and that is at inagainstdacom.

00:29:23.279 --> 00:29:30.035
And you know, everyone has a part to play in ending the stigma around domestic abuse and domestic violence.

00:29:30.035 --> 00:29:35.998
But this campaign was created around how to best support survivors and how you can best support survivors.

00:29:35.998 --> 00:29:49.200
So I think it's really important, if you know someone going through this, that you take a look there and also to you know if you need support yourself, because you are trying to support someone else going through a domestic violence situation.

00:29:49.601 --> 00:29:55.820
Yeah, absolutely, and we can put that link in the show notes so that anyone can have access to it and we can make sure it gets to more folks.

00:29:55.820 --> 00:29:57.284
Thank you, that's really important.

00:29:57.284 --> 00:30:00.894
Do you want to tell us a little more about?

00:30:00.894 --> 00:30:04.102
Is it ICADV or is it ICADV?

00:30:04.102 --> 00:30:06.498
I don't know how it's pronounced ICADV.

00:30:06.518 --> 00:30:06.980
Okay, it ICADV.

00:30:06.980 --> 00:30:08.365
I don't know how it's pronounced.

00:30:08.385 --> 00:30:08.506
ICADV.

00:30:08.506 --> 00:30:09.249
Okay, say the letters yeah.

00:30:09.790 --> 00:30:15.394
So I can tell you a little bit about my role with ICADV and what I've done in the last four years or so.

00:30:15.394 --> 00:30:27.104
When I came on with ICADV it was right before the pandemic, so I started in January of 2020 and then life changed for everyone in March of 2020.

00:30:27.104 --> 00:30:28.887
And then life changed for everyone in March of 2020.

00:30:28.887 --> 00:30:44.516
So I came on board right after ICADV had received a sub award for the HUD domestic violence bonus funds and we were tasked with, you know, subbing that money out throughout the state to create additional housing options for survivors.

00:30:44.516 --> 00:30:46.784
So we did that.

00:30:46.784 --> 00:30:53.241
Those programs are thriving, they're moving, they're still in existence, but we are no longer a pass through organization for that.

00:30:53.422 --> 00:31:28.373
So probably over the past two years or so, my role has changed drastically and I work now with you know, all over the state sometimes in Indianapolis with Cobra in Place or other member programs but to provide technical assistance around their housing projects, look at best practices, help them with development of policies and procedures, and then sometimes just a fresh set of eyes to look at things that they're doing and how they might, you know, have different outcomes if they made some changes within their programs.

00:31:28.373 --> 00:31:35.114
We're also big on training, so we do provide a lot of training specifically in the balance of state.

00:31:35.114 --> 00:31:45.758
We've joined Marion County in certain areas, yeah, but we do a lot of training around trauma, informed care, vawa, housing rights.

00:31:45.758 --> 00:32:07.176
I know that Tracy touched on VAWA a little bit earlier, but specifically that's one of like our most requested training specifically from housing providers is housing rights for survivors under VAWA, but also knowing that Indiana can be somewhat unique in offering additional protections for market rate housing for survivors.

00:32:07.758 --> 00:32:13.494
Yeah, so VAWA for those who are not familiar with this acronym stands for the Violence Against Women Act.

00:32:13.494 --> 00:32:21.517
It does not only apply to women and it is an act that creates amendments to housing agreements like leases.

00:32:21.517 --> 00:32:23.181
Correct me if I'm wrong.

00:32:23.240 --> 00:32:34.794
I'm pulling from my case manager remembrance and also the really good training that help for folks who are victims or survivors of domestic violence to break their lease without penalty.

00:32:34.794 --> 00:32:46.617
They should be able to move between programs without being penalized, to the best of our ability to do so, which we recognize is limited, but it does really offer some good protections.

00:32:46.917 --> 00:33:00.351
Under Indiana law there is the opportunities to expunge evictions, not just for survivors but anyone in the state.

00:33:00.351 --> 00:33:01.653
And now there's certain criteria that has to be met.

00:33:01.653 --> 00:33:05.219
And I'm going to start with I'm not an attorney and I don't pretend to be one, so this is not legal advice.

00:33:05.219 --> 00:33:11.069
But we run pro se eviction clinics at ICADV.

00:33:11.069 --> 00:33:18.291
They're virtual and survivors can join those to have their records expunged when there's not a judgment against them.

00:33:18.291 --> 00:33:34.940
So, as Tracy mentioned earlier, there are a lot of situations that come up where survivors are facing eviction, whether that be to the victimization that they've experienced or, you know, cutting off contact with the person causing harm that was also paying part of the rent.

00:33:34.940 --> 00:33:43.670
There could be many things that you know force a survivor to vacate or they get an eviction on their record.

00:33:43.670 --> 00:33:53.058
So we are running some pro se clinics where we offer that support to survivors to help them get that eviction expunged.

00:33:53.058 --> 00:34:07.759
But I also think we were doing a great job of training around the state and advising programs of survivors rights Because you know, just vacating a unit may not always be the best option.

00:34:07.880 --> 00:34:12.902
There may be opportunity to avoid an eviction, especially if there's violence involved.

00:34:13.543 --> 00:34:26.197
So with the VAWA that applies to federal housing or federally subsidized housing, whereas there are some protections under Indiana law that apply to private market or market rate housing.

00:34:26.717 --> 00:34:44.612
So that will still allow survivors to break a lease when there's a protective order in place and there is a recommendation to relocate from a safety plan, from an accredited domestic violence program in the state, so with that survivors are able to break their lease.

00:34:44.612 --> 00:34:46.634
So with that, survivors are able to break their lease.

00:34:46.634 --> 00:34:52.099
They do have to give a notice, a 30-day notice, and provide those documents to their landlord.

00:34:52.099 --> 00:34:56.144
There's also the option under Indiana law to change locks if needed.

00:34:56.144 --> 00:34:59.572
Important, yeah, super important.

00:34:59.572 --> 00:35:12.302
So there are some additional hoops to jump through under Indiana law, but it's much better than not having those protections in place for survivors Indiana law, but you know it's much better than not having those protections in place for survivors Under VAWA and the federal law.

00:35:12.302 --> 00:35:14.244
You don't have to have all of that documentation.

00:35:14.244 --> 00:35:26.802
So survivors are able to, you know, move between programs, like you mentioned, or break their leases, lease bifurcation, all of those options without some of the additional supporting documentation.

00:35:26.822 --> 00:35:30.248
All of those options without some of the additional supporting documentation.

00:35:30.248 --> 00:35:35.492
That's really great.

00:35:35.492 --> 00:35:40.411
How can folks access some of this wealth of knowledge If you're a survivor looking to break your lease, for example, is there a specific resource that we can link in the show notes?

00:35:40.891 --> 00:35:47.880
Yeah, I would recommend that you use our website at icadvincorg.

00:35:47.880 --> 00:35:57.110
We have a find help button on there and there's all of the domestic violence programs within the state and you can specifically narrow that down by county.

00:35:57.110 --> 00:36:01.585
But all programs are going to have access to those resources.

00:36:01.585 --> 00:36:13.983
And then I also recommend following ICADV on social media and checking our website specifically, because we also do advertise those eviction expungement clinics and all of that.

00:36:13.983 --> 00:36:22.043
So connecting with a local domestic violence program such as Coburn Place is going to give survivors access to those resources.

00:36:22.967 --> 00:36:23.269
Wonderful.

00:36:23.269 --> 00:36:38.657
And also just note for folks experiencing domestic violence if you are worried that your phone or your computer is being monitored, um, be mindful of what you're accessing and making sure you're in a safe space libraries are a great resource.

00:36:38.657 --> 00:36:40.733
Or make sure you're clearing your browser history.

00:36:40.733 --> 00:36:42.219
Stay safe, everybody.

00:36:42.219 --> 00:36:52.173
I think there's some apps for that, but I'm unfamiliar for helping keep like spyware off of your phone, because man people get creative in the horrible ways they treat other people Absolutely.

00:36:52.454 --> 00:36:52.735
Yes.

00:36:54.030 --> 00:36:56.980
Well, can we hear a little bit about how you came into this work, Erica?

00:36:57.750 --> 00:37:08.943
Yeah, so I have spent most of my life I guess my working life, life, I guess my working life working with underserved populations.

00:37:08.943 --> 00:37:40.643
So I started that work working with individuals living with HIV, and then I moved into homeless services and then specifically grant management and then I noticed a real need with survivors, the support for survivors, and that's kind of what called me into my work with ICADV, specifically because they were hiring for a role that they did not have before and that was specifically in housing and I had experience in housing.

00:37:40.643 --> 00:37:58.157
I also realized how close domestic violence was to me and the people that I know personally and it just felt right and I couldn't be more excited and more happy for the change that I made and the population that I'm serving, because it grows me.

00:37:58.157 --> 00:38:06.277
I learn something new every day and I think that it's just, it was the best move I could have made.

00:38:06.277 --> 00:38:09.425
So I hope to continue this work for many, many years.

00:38:09.445 --> 00:38:13.034
It was the best move I could have made, so I hope to continue this work for many, many years.

00:38:13.034 --> 00:38:18.802
That's really wonderful, and thank you for doing this work and for sharing how you got to it, and you too, tracy.

00:38:18.802 --> 00:38:21.387
Are there other things you want to share before we move into?

00:38:22.047 --> 00:38:40.126
wrapping up, one thing that I'll share is that one of the things we've been really studying and really kind of expanding our program around is the two-gen approach and whole family programs and whole family care.

00:38:41.018 --> 00:38:44.141
We've really noticed that there's a cycle when it comes to abuse.

00:38:44.141 --> 00:38:46.864
My father was abusive to my mother.

00:38:46.864 --> 00:39:05.096
I went through an abusive relationship and the studies say that children who witness abuse are six times more likely to commit suicide, are 74% more likely to do harm on some for some to someone else, and three times more likely to be abused or be an abuser.

00:39:05.096 --> 00:39:16.036
And we really want to break that cycle, and so the way that we're coming to break that cycle, or the way that we're really supporting the healing of the children, is providing this two gen approach.

00:39:16.036 --> 00:39:24.320
We are simultaneously programs that are going on for their parents is also going on for them and in a lot of cases, together.

00:39:24.320 --> 00:39:26.164
So we'll have a big.

00:39:26.164 --> 00:39:31.706
Our health program is putting on a big retreat in a couple of weeks where all of the families get to come out.

00:39:31.706 --> 00:39:44.248
They'll have children activities, they'll have therapy groups, they'll have self-care programs, they have someone showing how to do your makeup and yoga and just all of the things that would help you in your healing journey.

00:39:44.394 --> 00:40:02.650
We're all going on a family trip to Newport Aquarium in a couple of weeks at the end of summer camp and so really just supporting that family we found has really helped to is the science behind breaking that generational trauma and that generational cycle of abuse.

00:40:02.954 --> 00:40:08.394
Yes, that's amazing and that really heartens me to hear, because, absolutely so.

00:40:08.394 --> 00:40:14.202
When you say two gen, I assume you're being too generational to just, um, make sure we're clear for everybody.

00:40:14.202 --> 00:40:15.865
Uh, that's magical.

00:40:15.865 --> 00:40:35.007
I love that so much because every like the generations need healing to be able to continue supporting each other, and like we need our family units and we need our families to be able and have the capacity and knowledge and insight to take care of each other in the good ways and to show up better, because it's truly better for everybody.

00:40:35.835 --> 00:40:51.123
Absolutely, and really just having those experiences as a family creates those memories and it just creates that bonding experience with your family, because you have to realize that they've been through a lot of other experiences that are locked into their memory.

00:40:51.123 --> 00:41:01.518
So our goal is to create these positive experience and these positive memories as a family unit that they can hopefully take with them as they move on from our program.

00:41:01.717 --> 00:41:11.034
Yeah, and that's so impactful because those it's behavior change and it's giving people safe spaces to have that unique experience together and have positive memories.

00:41:11.034 --> 00:41:35.766
And, oh, we can come back to this Like this could be what it looks like, because often you don't know any other way to go through life if that's all you've ever seen, and that's when you get folks being like oh, of course, this is how I interact with my husband or my partner, or that's how my dad treated my mom and it's normalized in this very horrifying way, and so that's such a good antidote to that yes, and it's magical when you see the.

00:41:35.827 --> 00:41:41.295
When a parent sees their child healing and see something positive in their child is something that that does that parent.

00:41:41.295 --> 00:41:48.338
That really just opens up a window or a portal for them to be excited about healing as well.

00:41:48.338 --> 00:41:59.605
All the children are in camp right now, so they're having a summer camp and that allows the parents to go and focus on their healing journey and go to some of the other activities that Covent Place provides while they're in that camp.

00:41:59.605 --> 00:42:12.065
We are actually doing a fundraiser right now as well for back to school, because we want children to have the same experience of getting your new shoes, getting your new clothes, your school supplies, getting involved in a program.

00:42:12.065 --> 00:42:23.666
We know as parents that sports, football, any of those different things if you want to get involved, it costs a lot of money and, because of the financial abuse, a lot of our survivors don't have access to that or that's a barrier.

00:42:23.666 --> 00:42:28.766
So that's what we're raising funds for now to really support those kids and their education.

00:42:29.275 --> 00:42:30.398
That's wonderful.

00:42:30.398 --> 00:42:31.563
Thank you so much.

00:42:31.563 --> 00:42:39.750
And what ways can our listeners help with the great vast issue of domestic violence in our community?

00:42:39.750 --> 00:42:39.994
Like?

00:42:39.994 --> 00:42:45.304
What things can folks take away from this of like here's how I can get involved or show up better for people.

00:42:45.304 --> 00:42:54.226
We talked a little bit about it, but anything else or like yes for awesome programming that gonna help survivors exactly.

00:42:54.347 --> 00:42:56.036
You can go to coburnplaceorg.

00:42:56.036 --> 00:42:58.141
You can also follow us on social media.

00:42:58.141 --> 00:43:05.422
Um, coburnplaceorg slash lemons is um, specifically our lemonade stand fundraiser.

00:43:05.422 --> 00:43:14.346
We actually if you're local, like I'm sure a lot of your listeners are, and this airs before the end on july 18th, we'll have a lemonade stand at coburn place.

00:43:14.346 --> 00:43:19.192
The kids are going to be manning the lemonade stand and um, and they get really excited about it.

00:43:19.192 --> 00:43:27.038
It actually started several years ago as an idea from the kids and then development kind of took it over, but um, but yes, so they'll be doing that.

00:43:27.038 --> 00:43:28.621
Uh, we'll be at several locations.

00:43:28.621 --> 00:43:33.369
We'll also be at Monument Circle outside of Christ Cathedral Church and at Charles Schwab.

00:43:33.369 --> 00:43:46.447
We also have a spiked lemonade stand the very next day, july 19th, at Hotel Tango in Fletcher Place, and so we'll be there and we'll have a lot of fun things and some lemonade inspired cocktails as well.

00:43:47.476 --> 00:43:58.827
And for ICADV, we have our annual race away from domestic violence coming up in August that's August 10th of this year at the IU Michael A Carroll Stadium.

00:43:58.827 --> 00:44:04.144
That, yeah, it's our annual 5K.

00:44:04.144 --> 00:44:13.182
It does help us raise the needed funds to support survivors in the programs that we offer support to, so I encourage you all to come out.

00:44:13.182 --> 00:44:18.507
It is a walk, run, roll, whatever, whatever fits you, whatever you're interested in.

00:44:18.507 --> 00:44:25.047
So, yeah, you can visit our website at ICADVINCorg to learn more.

00:44:25.047 --> 00:44:37.369
And the last thing I would just, you know, leave you all with is just to believe survivors, believe what they tell you and respect their experiences and listen to their experiences.

00:44:37.369 --> 00:44:39.983
We have a lot to learn from survivors.

00:44:41.655 --> 00:44:42.657
We absolutely do.

00:44:42.657 --> 00:44:47.987
Thank you both so much for spending this lovely afternoon with us.

00:44:47.987 --> 00:44:57.143
I guess it's morning, I don't know what time is, friends, but no, this has been so great and so informative and thank you for sharing your hearts and your work with our listeners.

00:44:57.143 --> 00:45:11.425
Thanks to all of our listeners who are here and supporting each other and working for a better future for our community and our neighbors, and thanks for joining us all and amazing survivors on the journey homeward.