March 5, 2024

Episode 26 - Uncovering Discrimination: The Fight for Fair Housing with Erika Fotsch and Brady Ripperger

Episode 26 - Uncovering Discrimination: The Fight for Fair Housing with Erika Fotsch and Brady Ripperger
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Have you ever felt the sting of injustice, that fleeting moment, or those arduous times where something doesn't seem right or fair? Meet Erika Fotsch and Brady Ripperger of the Fair Housing Center of Central Indiana, our esteemed guests who bring these subtle undercurrents of discrimination to the forefront. They provide us with a sobering look at how the fight for fair housing is far from over, despite the many strides we've made. From the challenges faced by those with disabilities to the nuanced 'discrimination with a smile,' this episode uncovers the ongoing battle for equality in the housing market, and the vital role of FHCCI's advocacy, testing, and community education in safeguarding our rights. 

 The episode provides a heartening glimpse into the future of fair housing advocacy, including a unique approach to fostering diversity and understanding in our children. We highlight an inspiring children's book project emphasizing the beauty of diverse communities, alongside critical reports on lending practices and the influence of out-of-state investors. Join us as we explore the intersection of housing, health, and longevity disparities, and how the passion and personal experiences of individuals like Erika and Brady are driving change towards a more inclusive society.

 Website:  https://www.fhcci.org/

From their contact page:

If you believe you may be a victim of housing discrimination or have questions about fair housing laws, contact:

Fair Housing Center of Central Indiana

Phone: 317-644-0673
 Toll-Free: 855-270-7280
 Relay: 711

Email: info@fhcci.org

Street Address: 445 N. Pennsylvania Street, Suite 811
 Indianapolis, IN 46204

Hours: By Appointment Only

Please note that due to our small staff and time required in and out of the office, we are unable to accept walk-ins. Fortunately, most matters can be handled by phone. If this is not possible, please call ahead to arrange an appointment. We do not have attorneys on staff so cannot provide legal advice. In addition, we do not receive funding to assist in issues applicable under Indiana Landlord/Tenant Law. No solicitations, please. 

Chapters

00:05 - Fair Housing Center of Central Indiana

04:28 - Fair Housing Organization and Its Mission

15:40 - Housing Act and Disabilities Accommodations

27:13 - Housing Discrimination and Fair Housing

32:39 - Engagement and Education in Fair Housing

42:44 - Housing Advocacy and Children's Book Project

Transcript
WEBVTT

00:00:05.511 --> 00:00:10.342
We call it discrimination with a smile, because you have no idea that you were discriminated against right.

00:00:12.939 --> 00:00:17.181
We have this amazing intake team will take down their story and we can walk them through their options.

00:00:19.199 --> 00:00:21.487
Dep outside and look around at your neighbors.

00:00:21.487 --> 00:00:22.687
Does everyone look like you?

00:00:22.687 --> 00:00:24.725
Does everyone love like you?

00:00:24.725 --> 00:00:26.565
Does everyone have the same abilities as you?

00:00:26.565 --> 00:00:30.347
If that's the case, for housing is not alive and well in your community.

00:00:33.240 --> 00:00:38.069
That is no longer a pet and therefore it does not qualify as a pet under their no pet policy.

00:00:38.069 --> 00:00:45.444
Some of the hardest things I have to do at an event is somebody comes out to me and they're like oh, this doesn't happen to me.

00:00:45.444 --> 00:00:46.067
And I'm looking at them.

00:00:46.067 --> 00:00:57.487
I was like I hate to break it to you, but it could be like people think that discrimination is a civil rights 1960s problem.

00:01:00.159 --> 00:01:09.506
We are making sure that every single Hoosier or someone that calls Indiana their home state, they have a fair and equal shot at finding whatever types of housing they want.

00:01:16.219 --> 00:01:23.186
Welcome to Homeward Indie, a bi-weekly conversation where we meet the people working to end homelessness in Indianapolis and hear their stories.

00:01:23.186 --> 00:01:24.724
I'm Elliott Zanz.

00:01:25.840 --> 00:01:26.941
And I'm Steve Barnhart.

00:01:26.941 --> 00:01:39.763
Welcome listeners.

00:01:39.763 --> 00:01:50.448
I'm happy to introduce two guests today, Erica Fodge and Brady Rippinger, both from the Fair Housing Center of Central Indiana.

00:01:50.448 --> 00:02:01.406
Please join us as we listen in on how the Fair Housing Act of 1968 is being implemented to this day in Central Indiana.

00:02:01.406 --> 00:02:06.469
Erica and Brady, thank you so much for taking part with Homeward Indie.

00:02:07.480 --> 00:02:08.021
Thanks for having us.

00:02:08.021 --> 00:02:09.026
We're really excited to be here.

00:02:09.764 --> 00:02:10.759
Yeah, we're super excited to be here.

00:02:10.759 --> 00:02:15.319
You guys are with the Fair Housing Center of Central Indiana, correct?

00:02:15.901 --> 00:02:17.929
Yeah, quite a mouthful, right yeah it is.

00:02:18.360 --> 00:02:21.989
Is that how you usually refer to yourselves, or do you kind of shortcut it somehow?

00:02:23.180 --> 00:02:27.485
If I'm meeting somebody new, I'll start with the full thing, and then we always pretty much shorten it to the FHCTI.

00:02:27.866 --> 00:02:28.328
All right.

00:02:28.328 --> 00:02:32.088
Well, why don't you tell us a little bit about what the organization does?

00:02:32.088 --> 00:02:34.906
Either one of you can go All right.

00:02:35.841 --> 00:02:46.131
Well, the Fair Housing Center is the only existing advocacy nonprofit in the state of Indiana that focuses on eliminating and addressing housing discrimination.

00:02:47.000 --> 00:03:07.103
So that encompasses a lot of different things within the housing industry and the housing sphere, but we really focus in on determining and making sure that your rights are not being violated because you're black, because you have a minor child, because you have a disability, you're in a same-sex relationship, you were in a hijab or go to a certain temple or place of worship.

00:03:07.103 --> 00:03:17.070
We are making sure that every single Hoosier or someone that calls Indiana their home state, they have a fair and equal shot at finding whatever types of housing they want.

00:03:17.070 --> 00:03:40.064
So, whether that be they're trying to buy a house, trying to buy land, they're trying to rent an apartment, trying to get a mortgage, an appraisal, homeowners insurance, renters insurance anything that's really directly or indirectly related to the housing industry, we are making sure that discrimination and bias, whether implicit or direct, is not taking place in our system.

00:03:40.064 --> 00:03:48.382
So it's a very large task that we've got to do especially as one of the only groups in the state here.

00:03:48.502 --> 00:03:50.887
But we exist in Indianapolis.

00:03:50.887 --> 00:03:57.151
That's where our main headquarters, our office are and we serve the central 24 counties.

00:03:57.151 --> 00:04:01.962
So kind of the visual I say is go east and west to both sides of the state.

00:04:01.962 --> 00:04:06.209
North to about Kokomo, muncie, anderson, down south to Bloomington.

00:04:06.209 --> 00:04:11.531
But as we all know on here today, discrimination does not know service areas.

00:04:11.531 --> 00:04:13.766
So we've got to go outside of that.

00:04:13.766 --> 00:04:24.274
We've had several cases and clients call us from all over the state, southern Indiana all the way up to the tip top of the northern part of the state, and so the service area is there to kind of help us with our grants.

00:04:24.274 --> 00:04:27.146
But we unfortunately do have to go outside of that quite a bit.

00:04:28.161 --> 00:04:36.226
Just a general question are there more than just you guys of this organization, or are you one of a kind here?

00:04:36.226 --> 00:04:37.524
It's a great question.

00:04:37.720 --> 00:04:41.009
So we often get confused with being a government agency.

00:04:41.009 --> 00:04:42.725
We are actually completely private.

00:04:42.725 --> 00:04:44.283
We're a private nonprofit.

00:04:44.283 --> 00:04:48.829
There are several other entities doing the same types of work across the country.

00:04:48.829 --> 00:04:51.728
Ohio, I think, has five to seven groups.

00:04:51.728 --> 00:04:53.345
Michigan has five to seven groups.

00:04:53.345 --> 00:04:56.980
They're all doing the same mission work, but they're all private.

00:04:56.980 --> 00:04:59.365
You're all autonomous from each other?

00:04:59.365 --> 00:05:04.120
Exactly yes, so we are the only one doing this type of work in Indiana.

00:05:04.120 --> 00:05:05.403
How did you guys get started?

00:05:06.800 --> 00:05:14.829
So there is a national group called the National Fair Housing Alliance and their mission is exactly like ours, but just on a national scale.

00:05:14.829 --> 00:05:24.826
And they kind of took a step back back in 2012, and they realized that there was not really a functioning fair housing group in the state of Indiana.

00:05:26.360 --> 00:05:45.336
And, being the state and kind of the politics of the state, fair housing is very much so important here, especially the advocacy around the work that we do, and so they developed and applied for a grant from HUD, and we were often running at the end of 2012 when we officially opened our doors in January of 2013.

00:05:45.800 --> 00:05:48.747
So you're a little over 10 years old, then yeah, yeah.

00:05:50.199 --> 00:05:51.946
Celebrating our 12th anniversary this year.

00:05:53.360 --> 00:05:58.891
Have the two of you been with the organization the whole time or you've joined more recently?

00:06:00.040 --> 00:06:01.766
So I'm a really new person here.

00:06:01.766 --> 00:06:17.963
I've only been here oh two years in June, but I'm super excited to be here and super excited to be on this amazing team we're actually at the largest we've ever been and so we're able to expand our services and help more people and educate more people around their fair housing rights.

00:06:17.963 --> 00:06:26.548
And I just think it's kind of telling that this organization has been around 12 years, but the Fair Housing Act has been around 55, 56 years now.

00:06:26.548 --> 00:06:40.906
So we have an uphill battle ahead of us, and so just spreading the word and letting people know that these protections are in place and really empowering the community around it to reach out to us and let them know that this resource exists is super important.

00:06:41.959 --> 00:06:44.548
How many people are on staff here?

00:06:45.100 --> 00:06:47.309
We've got a total of nine full-time staff members.

00:06:47.309 --> 00:06:49.648
So when we first started it was about five.

00:06:49.648 --> 00:06:59.052
For a majority of the first 10 years it was a staff of five, and then we have been lucky enough to grow and expand our resources to nine this year.

00:06:59.540 --> 00:07:00.142
Oh, excellent.

00:07:00.142 --> 00:07:04.129
So let's go back to about 10 years ago.

00:07:04.129 --> 00:07:10.069
There's this national organization saying we need someone here in Indiana.

00:07:10.069 --> 00:07:16.410
How did they go about finding the people and how did that happen?

00:07:17.759 --> 00:07:28.526
So Amy Nelson actually is the founding executive director of our agency and, similar to how we started about 12 years ago, they're actually starting a group in Memphis, tennessee, this year as well.

00:07:28.526 --> 00:07:34.271
So really the process of that is you analyze the funding and the need kind of the demand.

00:07:34.271 --> 00:07:49.144
And so the National Fair Housing Alliance applied for the funds to the US Department of Housing and Urban Development through their FIP initiatives, so their Fair Housing Initiative programs program, and that allowed us to open our doors.

00:07:49.144 --> 00:07:54.209
So we were founded with certain founding board members.

00:07:54.209 --> 00:07:57.689
We still actually have one of our founding board members currently, which is really exciting.

00:07:57.689 --> 00:07:59.826
And then Amy Nelson is still on our team.

00:07:59.826 --> 00:08:04.149
She's been a strong force to keep us going the last 12 years or so.

00:08:05.199 --> 00:08:09.149
Is Amy local here or did she moved here as you started?

00:08:09.800 --> 00:08:12.187
So Amy is a champion in the Fair Housing Movement.

00:08:12.187 --> 00:08:19.689
She has been well over 25 years of experience, so I think it's someone that Eric and I both look up to professionally and personally.

00:08:19.689 --> 00:08:21.742
But she moved.

00:08:21.742 --> 00:08:31.925
She's born in the Dakotas, spent some time all over, kind of did some work for Fair Housing and Home of Virginia, which is in Virginia, and then moved over here once she was hired for the position.

00:08:32.260 --> 00:08:33.985
And Brady's being really modest.

00:08:33.985 --> 00:08:37.147
We're not lucky that we got to nine people.

00:08:37.147 --> 00:08:39.388
We got to nine people because of Brady and Amy's work.

00:08:39.559 --> 00:08:40.804
So I just want to point that out.

00:08:40.804 --> 00:08:42.783
So, brady, have you been with the?

00:08:42.844 --> 00:08:44.307
organization since the start?

00:08:44.307 --> 00:08:50.451
I actually have not, so I graduated from a university here in May of 2013.

00:08:50.451 --> 00:08:53.784
And then this is my very first full-time job, that following winter.

00:08:53.884 --> 00:08:55.027
So it's pretty close too.

00:08:55.027 --> 00:08:56.929
Yeah, pretty close, a little over 10 years.

00:08:56.929 --> 00:09:05.030
Okay, excellent, tell me a little bit about who you serve.

00:09:05.030 --> 00:09:10.610
How does that relationship happen and what does it look like?

00:09:11.591 --> 00:09:11.952
Yeah.

00:09:11.952 --> 00:09:16.490
So people call our office for all kinds of different reasons, mostly related to housing.

00:09:16.490 --> 00:09:26.025
We help the people that we can and we also refer them to other agencies if our agency doesn't cover the issues that they're experiencing.

00:09:26.025 --> 00:09:31.111
But the people that we can actually help are the people who are experiencing housing discrimination.

00:09:31.111 --> 00:09:37.192
So if they're being treated differently because of a personal characteristic that's protected, we can help them.

00:09:37.192 --> 00:09:40.307
So the protected characteristics on a federal level we have seven of them.

00:09:40.307 --> 00:09:50.288
It's race, color, national origin, religion, disability, any family that has a minor child or multiple, and then gender or sex.

00:09:51.701 --> 00:09:54.250
I'm impressed that you think it all falls to seven.

00:09:54.250 --> 00:09:58.629
As soon as I say a list like that, I'm like well, I get all but one.

00:09:59.440 --> 00:10:00.605
And I went out of order too.

00:10:00.605 --> 00:10:03.106
So I was like, wait, let me not mess this up.

00:10:03.246 --> 00:10:04.110
That was impressive.

00:10:04.440 --> 00:10:06.638
But I am the education outreach coordinator, so if I couldn't do, the list.

00:10:06.677 --> 00:10:07.621
It might be a little concerning.

00:10:10.440 --> 00:10:12.246
So those are the protections we have on a federal level.

00:10:12.246 --> 00:10:14.647
Each locality might have additional protections.

00:10:14.647 --> 00:10:16.744
Here in Marion County we have a couple.

00:10:16.744 --> 00:10:20.285
The state of Indiana for all intents and purposes doesn't.

00:10:20.285 --> 00:10:21.710
That's the list that we have.

00:10:21.710 --> 00:10:57.333
There is ancestry which is highly correlated with national origin, but basically anybody who's experiencing discrimination because of one or more of those characteristics within the housing realm so rental or home ownership, anything kind of related to that is protected, and so they can call our agency and we have this amazing intake team will take down their story and we can walk them through their options as far as if they're interested in filing a complaint or anything like that, and then we can also open broader, systemic investigations if we notice that a particular you know, larger company that owns multiple properties.

00:10:57.333 --> 00:11:00.144
We notice a lot of the same problems with multiple properties.

00:11:00.600 --> 00:11:11.946
We even cross state lines, sometimes in partner with other fair housing organizations in other states, if property managers or people who own properties in multiple states are found to be violating fair housing laws.

00:11:13.279 --> 00:11:17.708
What would be a typical scenario without naming names?

00:11:19.840 --> 00:11:24.576
So it's very interesting, because there are seven federally protected classes.

00:11:24.576 --> 00:11:27.908
There's so much intersectionality between them, right?

00:11:27.908 --> 00:11:42.706
So oftentimes what we find is that we have a single mother calling in, but she also happens to be black, and so, right there, you have familial status protections, you have race and color protections and gender sex protections, and so there's a lot of intersectionality.

00:11:42.706 --> 00:11:56.586
But overall and this compares to national trends as well we find that persons with disabilities whether that be mental, physical, cognitive or intellectual those are the people that are contacting our office the most.

00:11:56.586 --> 00:12:00.626
Several reasons for that Our population is living longer.

00:12:00.626 --> 00:12:10.808
We are aging and living longer, which is great, but if you do live a long, healthy life, you're most likely at some point going to be a member of the protected class of disability, right?

00:12:10.808 --> 00:12:26.692
So you're not able to take care of yourself, you can't feed, you have struggle walking up and down stairs, there might be mental deterioration, memory or cognitive disabilities, and so that's one of the reasons that we kind of feel that disability is a higher complaint.

00:12:26.692 --> 00:12:44.349
But we also find that there are protections awarded to persons with disabilities under the Federal Fair Housing Act that are awarded just to people with disabilities, and those include certain protections to ensure that your property that you're living in or renting from or buying from is accessible.

00:12:44.349 --> 00:12:47.648
So multi-family properties with four or more units.

00:12:47.648 --> 00:12:57.448
There's a specific date March 13, 1991, if it was built on or after that date, it has to be made accessible to persons with physical disabilities.

00:12:57.448 --> 00:13:01.408
So that's one of the way that the Fair Housing Act adds some additional protections.

00:13:02.139 --> 00:13:08.663
A second way is that it allows people to request what are called reasonable accommodations or modifications.

00:13:09.500 --> 00:13:20.364
We all know that the housing stock, when you look at all these single-family houses or when you're going to buy or rent an apartment, most of the times it's not made for people with disabilities.

00:13:20.759 --> 00:13:31.701
And so a way that the Fair Housing Act really helped to award further protections and give persons with disabilities greater options and ability to choose wherever they want to live.

00:13:31.701 --> 00:13:47.546
You can make physical or structural or rules or policy-based accommodations or modifications to make you, wherever you want to live, accommodating and accessible to your disabilities, whether that be mental or physical.

00:13:47.546 --> 00:13:55.647
So going off of that disability is the most common protected class and allegations that we receive at the office across the state.

00:13:55.647 --> 00:14:04.285
But interestingly, when you kind of dig into the world of disabilities, oftentimes it's reasonable accommodations.

00:14:04.285 --> 00:14:13.910
So those more policy or rule-based exemptions that people are requesting, and within that kind of subset is people needing emotional support or service animals.

00:14:13.910 --> 00:14:25.910
So I think as a kind of a general country, we're kind of turning away from prescription drugs as much as we can to try to find more natural alternatives, and the medical industry, the psychologists, the therapists.

00:14:26.494 --> 00:14:32.270
There has been so much science saying that emotional support and service animals help people with physical and disabilities.

00:14:32.270 --> 00:14:57.609
Where the disconnect, though, and the work that we have to do, is that, even though the Fair Housing Act has been around since 1968, often, many times, landlords don't know their responsibilities under the Fair Housing Act, and so what that means is we have to have advocacy, like us, or education and outreach, like Erica does, to ensure that we're closing that gap from the housing perspectives or housing providers that do not know their rights or responsibilities.

00:14:57.609 --> 00:15:01.149
Going out of that, too, we also educate the general public.

00:15:01.149 --> 00:15:08.347
So if most people have never heard of the Fair Housing Act across the country, it's a real shame, because it's been around for 55 years.

00:15:08.347 --> 00:15:17.407
It's an extremely important tool in our toolkit for civil rights, but not enough people know about it, so I'm really excited to be here to get more of our mission out there.

00:15:20.299 --> 00:15:22.427
I'm curious with the service animal.

00:15:22.427 --> 00:15:39.403
It sounds like that's kind of a hot topic, something that has changed within the industry in more recent years, and I know that's huge too when it comes to even access to public places, airports, things like that.

00:15:39.403 --> 00:15:51.931
But as it relates to housing, erica, when you named off those seven items, one of them was not something about the right to have an animal, correct?

00:15:51.931 --> 00:15:53.879
How does that work.

00:15:53.879 --> 00:16:00.086
So for people with disabilities there are these things called reasonable modifications and reasonable accommodations.

00:16:00.086 --> 00:16:09.326
There's special protections in place for them, understanding that back in 1968, up until that point, I mean in the code of the act we still use the word handicapped.

00:16:09.326 --> 00:16:16.826
So we've come a long way in the realm of disabilities and how to speak about them and we're learning a lot more about them.

00:16:16.826 --> 00:16:19.745
And with that added protected class.

00:16:19.745 --> 00:16:22.350
That protected class didn't come in until 1988.

00:16:22.350 --> 00:16:39.490
So at that time it added for accommodations and modifications to housing, acknowledging the fact that there's so much of our housing stock is older than that and not designed with people with disabilities, different kinds of disabilities, in mind.

00:16:39.490 --> 00:16:43.595
And so where that comes into place when it comes to animals is a lot of.

00:16:43.595 --> 00:16:47.028
Let's just talk about apartment complexes, because it's the easiest route to go.

00:16:47.740 --> 00:17:05.588
A lot of them have a no pets policy and that's totally okay until somebody with a disability who needs a service animal or an assistance animal or an emotional support animal, depending on their disability and what they want to call it that is no longer a pet and therefore it does not qualify as a pet under their no pet policy.

00:17:05.588 --> 00:17:07.743
So they can go to their housing provider.

00:17:07.743 --> 00:17:22.191
They can say hello, I live here, I have a disability under the Fair Housing Act and I would like an accommodation to your no pets policy to allow my service animal, my assistance animal, my emotional support animal, what may it be, to live here with me.

00:17:22.191 --> 00:17:32.592
And as long as they qualify as somebody with a disability under the Fair Housing Act and they have that connection and why they need that animal, that housing provider has to allow it.

00:17:33.319 --> 00:17:37.068
So I assume that's where you potentially might get a phone call.

00:17:37.068 --> 00:17:44.512
Absolutely From that individual saying I need this, but it's no pets allowed.

00:17:44.512 --> 00:17:48.470
I ran the idea, but it's no pets allowed.

00:17:48.470 --> 00:17:50.564
Do I have any options?

00:17:50.964 --> 00:17:52.189
Yeah, so we get that call a lot.

00:17:52.189 --> 00:17:58.133
I also get a lot of arguing during different educational presentations from housing providers about animals.

00:17:58.133 --> 00:18:01.824
It's just a very it's a very hot topic and unfortunately it's just effects.

00:18:01.824 --> 00:18:06.507
If they have the disabilities and they need that animal, it is no longer a pet and there are no pets policies that they apply.

00:18:07.619 --> 00:18:10.809
We are trying to start to eradicate and undo some of those harms.

00:18:10.809 --> 00:18:12.325
But are they allowed?

00:18:12.325 --> 00:18:18.932
I could see where the argument would be hey, this is going to hurt my facility in some way.

00:18:18.932 --> 00:18:21.505
Are they able to charge extra for it?

00:18:21.505 --> 00:18:22.627
Or anything like that.

00:18:23.028 --> 00:18:31.089
No, so they can't charge any pet fees, any additional deposits, insurance, nothing like that can be charged to the person with a disability for any kind of accommodation.

00:18:32.688 --> 00:18:34.660
It just needs to be built into their whole system.

00:18:34.720 --> 00:18:46.403
It's just part of their service as a housing provider, to make sure that they are equitably a living乐, willing to accept their finances, willing to continue their commitment to their offering housing to people with disabilities, and they just so happen to have a tenant who has a disability who needs that animal.

00:18:46.403 --> 00:18:54.219
Now, of course, just like any reasonable person, that person has to, you know, make sure that their animals not disruptive and not being overly burdensome.

00:18:54.219 --> 00:18:57.631
Like there are lease agreements that have to be Maintained.

00:18:57.631 --> 00:19:07.430
But, honestly, service animals, as far as, like most cases, are like the best-behaved animals, so we haven't run into a lot of issues with that.

00:19:07.430 --> 00:19:08.271
But that is.

00:19:08.451 --> 00:19:10.355
That is obviously a concern so.

00:19:10.496 --> 00:19:18.201
So once you've been able to intervene in some fashion, I'd like to kind of hear what that intervention looks like.

00:19:18.201 --> 00:19:23.679
But your experience so far is that's turned out to be okay.

00:19:23.679 --> 00:19:32.203
Those fears have not come about in terms of animals ruining the place or Barking or whatever the case may be.

00:19:32.948 --> 00:19:33.230
I mean it's.

00:19:33.230 --> 00:19:36.040
You can't judge a book by its cover, right?

00:19:36.040 --> 00:19:46.650
So the thing is, you know you could have the best well-behaved dog and they just have a really bad day, and so they decided to bark all night because they didn't sleep well, you know.

00:19:46.650 --> 00:19:55.858
And so we have to kind of take on a case-by-case basis these animals, not make an entire assumption about a breed, assuming that they're, you know, dangerous for example like pit bulls.

00:19:55.939 --> 00:20:02.439
Unfortunately, and kind of going off of what Erica said too, is you are responsible for your animal right.

00:20:02.439 --> 00:20:07.555
So if the the animal bites a hole in the wall, you know you are responsible for a pain for that.

00:20:07.555 --> 00:20:09.079
That's above normal wear and tear.

00:20:09.079 --> 00:20:16.990
So disability is the most common protection, but I don't want to discredit any of the other protected classes.

00:20:17.089 --> 00:20:17.171
Yes.

00:20:18.471 --> 00:20:40.609
The second highest that we find is actually race, and we kind of mix that with color, and so we have done tremendous work in the lending industry to Ensure that the effects and the histories of redlining that are still haunting our black and brown neighborhoods today, we are trying to start to eradicate and undo some of those harms.

00:20:40.609 --> 00:20:42.988
I think that it is important to note that.

00:20:42.988 --> 00:20:48.858
You know we receive all sorts of complaints against all protected classes, and so this is a great question and kind of answer.

00:20:48.858 --> 00:20:53.481
You know, regardless if you have a disability or if you're alleging religion discrimination, etc.

00:20:53.582 --> 00:20:54.443
So, yeah, what?

00:20:54.443 --> 00:20:56.329
What are the steps that you take?

00:20:56.730 --> 00:20:57.571
Exactly so.

00:20:57.571 --> 00:21:13.323
Really, the thing that we pride ourselves the most is that we will answer every single call, email contact to our office, and Oftentimes people are so frustrated because they've contacted 20 different agencies and we're the only one to answer our phone.

00:21:13.323 --> 00:21:17.797
So we really pride ourselves on that and, honestly, the first step is just listening.

00:21:17.797 --> 00:21:22.049
They have been through such tremendous or traumatic experiences.

00:21:22.049 --> 00:21:36.701
Just letting them vent, just letting them share their story, cry whatever they need to do To share what is going on in their life, because housing is so critical to every component of your life your education, access to healthy foods, etc.

00:21:36.701 --> 00:21:45.258
So just letting them, you know, kind of get out what they need to get out and then really discussing and meeting them where they're at and saying, hey, here are what we provide.

00:21:45.258 --> 00:21:53.678
We might not be able to provide everything for you here, but we have got some great referrals for you over here, but more times than not we actually are able to help these people.

00:21:53.678 --> 00:21:58.736
So if they are alleging housing discrimination, we really get their story.

00:21:58.736 --> 00:22:01.164
We listen to see what has been done so far.

00:22:01.164 --> 00:22:02.490
Have you done any communication?

00:22:02.490 --> 00:22:04.232
Have you already filed any complaints?

00:22:04.232 --> 00:22:09.683
Let's figure out where you're at in this process already and where we can try to help advocate on your behalf.

00:22:09.683 --> 00:22:24.761
Oftentimes it's getting better written documentation To a housing provider stating you know, I do have Concerns that the neighbor next door is Targeting me because I'm gay or because I'm a lesbian, for example.

00:22:24.761 --> 00:22:38.041
So getting those written documents to kind of help prove a better case if it ever does end up in going into a corridor, you know filing a complaint and then you know just reminding them that we are here to answer any questions.

00:22:38.041 --> 00:22:51.083
You know, if you want to brainstorm an idea that think you might you know might be a good, good fit, we also can help you file a complaint and then sometimes we actually do ourselves get involved in enforcement action on behalf of a client.

00:22:51.083 --> 00:22:54.916
So Sometimes there's just such egregious forms of discrimination.

00:22:54.916 --> 00:23:10.029
All discrimination is horrific, but there are times that we feel as an agency we also need to get involved to send a larger message to the community and making sure that this type of discrimination that's happening is not going to happen again.

00:23:10.751 --> 00:23:22.950
So I give you one quick example here over the COVID pandemic I was doing intakes and you know those intakes were hard because you're having people that are trying to find housing.

00:23:22.950 --> 00:23:25.170
You know the eviction notorious might be ending.

00:23:25.170 --> 00:23:30.019
They're trying to get rental assistance but their landlord doesn't accept it because we don't protect that in the state here.

00:23:30.019 --> 00:23:32.638
And so those calls were just horrific.

00:23:32.739 --> 00:23:35.990
But one will always stand out to me, and this was by a woman.

00:23:35.990 --> 00:23:38.997
She had just been laid off because of COVID.

00:23:38.997 --> 00:24:01.390
She was in the service industry, she was a single mom, she lived on the neary side here in Indianapolis and she had gotten a text message from her landlord stating that you know, if you sleep with me or you come over and what was essentially alleging sexual and intercourse, then we would forget about the rent and it would kind of all go away from there.

00:24:01.390 --> 00:24:08.237
And I just remember that story that she had because it was just, she was so vulnerable in that position.

00:24:08.237 --> 00:24:14.282
It was such a very special moment for both of us, just because we were able to kind of listen to each other and be there for each other.

00:24:15.271 --> 00:24:24.765
But we that type of discrimination is so, so horrific that we ended up collecting or connecting her with an attorney that does specialize in fair housing.

00:24:24.765 --> 00:24:32.403
They're out of California and we ourselves as an agency also got involved in that case alleging sex discrimination.

00:24:32.403 --> 00:24:37.374
So harassment is also protected under the Fair Housing Act and her news.

00:24:37.374 --> 00:24:38.837
Her story went viral.

00:24:38.837 --> 00:24:42.556
It made news over in the UK, made Buzzfeed I believe.

00:24:42.556 --> 00:24:49.743
But we were luckily able to settle that case very quickly for that client and you can learn about that on our advocacy page.

00:24:49.784 --> 00:24:56.914
Don't want to give any specifics, but yeah welcome to learn about that on our advocacy page, as well as our other cases that we have Filed and been part of as well.

00:24:56.914 --> 00:25:00.002
So those are just one of the examples, but I could go on, for.

00:25:00.002 --> 00:25:11.607
You're not a government agency, as you said, and you're Not a legal firm correct, we are not attorneys, so we we contract out when we do need some of that's.

00:25:11.627 --> 00:25:21.433
What that's the way, do you have particular attorneys that work pretty closely with you then that that are Particularly qualified?

00:25:21.775 --> 00:25:27.744
there are unfortunately very limited amounts of attorneys across the country that do specialize in Fair housing.

00:25:27.744 --> 00:25:38.019
So there's a really great firm in California went out in DC and then kind of smaller ones here and there, and so if Anyone is interested in kind of going that route, highly encourage it.

00:25:38.019 --> 00:25:39.823
The demand is extremely there.

00:25:39.823 --> 00:25:44.529
But yeah, the, the, the Fair Housing Specialist in the legal industry is very limited.

00:25:45.991 --> 00:26:03.609
So when you say you get involved, I mean obviously you get involved in terms of the intake, listening, giving suggestions, giving references, whatever what else is involved, mean so our intake team does a really good job.

00:26:03.851 --> 00:26:09.323
We will, if we need, to, go on site to visit you to learn more about your story and get documents.

00:26:09.323 --> 00:26:11.369
Whatever, we are willing to meet you wherever you are.

00:26:11.369 --> 00:26:22.630
You know, of course, staff resources and availability, but one of the other things that I think is incredibly interesting and unique to our agency is we will conduct investigations.

00:26:22.630 --> 00:26:28.769
So if you're alleging race discrimination, you get that weird gut feeling that something's just not right.

00:26:28.769 --> 00:26:31.038
You can't prove it's race discrimination.

00:26:31.038 --> 00:26:37.509
You can call our office so we can actually conduct Investigations to determine if discrimination took place or not.

00:26:38.532 --> 00:26:41.942
One of the coolest things that I love about our agency is our testing program.

00:26:41.942 --> 00:26:46.382
Our testing program is like civil rights secret shoppers.

00:26:46.382 --> 00:26:54.644
So what we will do is a client will call in and say I think that I was treated differently because I have a Hispanic accent.

00:26:54.644 --> 00:26:59.823
So what we'll do is we'll send in a tester with and a tester without Hispanic accent.

00:26:59.823 --> 00:27:01.654
See if they're treated any differently.

00:27:01.654 --> 00:27:04.142
Are they told the same terms and conditions?

00:27:04.142 --> 00:27:06.888
Is one offered a special versus not?

00:27:06.888 --> 00:27:09.957
Is One offered to move in tomorrow versus one?

00:27:09.957 --> 00:27:12.923
Is you know told nothing's gonna be available for two or three weeks?

00:27:12.923 --> 00:27:19.483
These are the very small minute ways that housing providers are smart now in ways that they discriminate.

00:27:19.483 --> 00:27:24.843
We call it discrimination with a smile, because you have no idea that you were discriminated against, right?

00:27:24.843 --> 00:27:30.061
And that is why our testing team is so critical to the work that we do.

00:27:31.192 --> 00:27:33.670
So you have people on staff that do that work.

00:27:34.574 --> 00:28:00.509
Yeah, our testing coordinators coordinate the tests and then we have fair housing testers, which are part-time employees that we reach out to to perform the tests for us, and so we are always recruiting new testers, and so it's a great opportunity for somebody who is looking to be a civil rights act, part of the civil rights movement, help enforce civil rights, rights and housing, but also it does provide a stipend for every test that you perform.

00:28:00.830 --> 00:28:04.910
And so what happens is our test coordinator will be like okay, we're gonna test this property.

00:28:04.910 --> 00:28:11.117
We got an allegation that they discriminate against somebody Because they are black, for example.

00:28:11.117 --> 00:28:17.163
So we'll have our testing pool and we'll have a control test and then we'll test based on that allegation.

00:28:17.163 --> 00:28:33.362
So we'll send in, for example, if we want to test the the allegation of black or American or African-American Discrimination, will send in a tester who is, for example, white or Caucasian, and then somebody who is black, mm-hmm, and they will go, you know, within a day or so of each other.

00:28:33.362 --> 00:28:40.450
They fill out this report of their entire experience and then our tester or test coordinators will analyze those reports in depth.

00:28:40.450 --> 00:28:47.824
And, as Brady was saying, you know that experience is very telling because were you greeted white right away, where you made to wait 30 minutes.

00:28:49.070 --> 00:28:49.471
Did they give?

00:28:49.491 --> 00:28:57.430
you tours of two or three apartments versus just one, where you told you had to have this down payment and this person wasn't told down payment at all.

00:28:57.430 --> 00:28:59.798
Do you have to do a criminal history check?

00:28:59.798 --> 00:29:03.700
Was that asked of both candidates or just one?

00:29:03.700 --> 00:29:05.834
And so it's.

00:29:05.834 --> 00:29:11.954
It's very interesting to consider that if you had just gone in by yourself, your experience is your experience.

00:29:11.954 --> 00:29:19.990
Yeah, you have nothing to compare it to, but our fair housing or test coordinators can compare that and uncover that discriminatory behavior.

00:29:20.512 --> 00:29:22.301
I'm curious with that.

00:29:22.301 --> 00:29:34.231
Whenever you get those Calls of I suspect that this is going on and you run a test like that, what are the Outcomes of those?

00:29:34.231 --> 00:29:37.898
Usually do you usually find now there's not this going on.

00:29:37.898 --> 00:29:39.141
Or you know what?

00:29:39.141 --> 00:29:42.714
Almost always we find that the hunch was correct.

00:29:42.714 --> 00:29:44.157
What would you say?

00:29:44.578 --> 00:29:54.843
There's not really a calculation, but I will say that there is an alarming rate that we find more discrimination than I would hope in the state of Indiana.

00:29:54.843 --> 00:30:01.512
So Can't give out specifics, but I will say that there's still an alarming rate of discrimination and is it?

00:30:01.753 --> 00:30:09.182
is it happening in particular Protected areas or is it across the board?

00:30:09.786 --> 00:30:10.750
It's really across the board.

00:30:10.769 --> 00:30:20.256
Yeah, I mean, we still see major trends in disability, race, gender and familial status, but it's happening to everyone, and I kind of just want to, I think, point this out.

00:30:20.296 --> 00:30:41.819
This important note is that there are national estimates that there's like 38,000 complaints filed across the country, but there are estimates that there's over four million incidents that occur every single year in the country, so less than one percent of complaints are actually being filed, and so when we tell you these this data, it might be completely different.

00:30:41.819 --> 00:30:42.961
It's probably not.

00:30:42.961 --> 00:30:49.948
But you know, people are so scared to contact a fair housing group because they don't want to be retaliated against, they don't want to lose their housing.

00:30:49.948 --> 00:30:52.140
This is the only housing that they can afford anymore.

00:30:52.140 --> 00:30:54.729
They don't know about their fair housing rights.

00:30:54.729 --> 00:30:56.963
They fear for their safety.

00:30:56.963 --> 00:31:09.132
There's just so many variables that are involved in that, and so it is extremely important that you do contact your fair housing center, because it does allow us to get out into the community and say that this is a group that's being impacted.

00:31:09.132 --> 00:31:13.270
Let's invest our resources and investigate this type of discrimination.

00:31:14.162 --> 00:31:21.054
Well, I will say, and as Brady mentioned earlier, even if you just have like a spidey sense not to like, bring Marvel into conversation.

00:31:22.261 --> 00:31:23.768
My grandson would appreciate.

00:31:24.701 --> 00:31:33.279
You don't have to know that you're being discriminated against if you just, if something feels wrong or if they said something that just You're like, that just didn't feel quite right, call us.

00:31:33.279 --> 00:31:45.045
We might have had other people who have called us and we can be like oh, this seems like we've gotten quite a few that Seemed to think the same thing and we can open that investigation because, like, like we said, it's discrimination with a smile.

00:31:45.586 --> 00:31:50.079
They either and some of it, you know, is on purpose and some of it may not be, but it doesn't matter.

00:31:50.079 --> 00:31:56.949
It's still affecting access to housing for these particular groups of yes, do you charge anything for your services?

00:31:56.949 --> 00:31:58.323
Absolutely not.

00:31:59.542 --> 00:32:05.976
No charge to anybody who contacts you know, Let me just ask the follow-up to that.

00:32:05.976 --> 00:32:06.920
Then you mentioned grants.

00:32:06.920 --> 00:32:09.519
How are you funded?

00:32:11.586 --> 00:32:15.059
So we receive majority of our funding through the US Department of Housing and Urban Development.

00:32:15.059 --> 00:32:19.920
So they offer grants specifically for private nonprofit, for housing groups like ours.

00:32:19.920 --> 00:32:26.200
We are lucky enough to have some local funders as well, so the city of Indianapolis to their CDBG partnership.

00:32:26.200 --> 00:32:36.319
Recently we were funded through the Urban League as well, and there's probably some other people that I'm forgetting as now, but there are some other incredible local partnerships that we have to Excellent.

00:32:39.069 --> 00:32:48.759
One of the things that we like to do is Allow our listeners To learn ways they can plug in to what you're doing.

00:32:48.759 --> 00:32:53.420
What might that look like with your organization?

00:32:54.240 --> 00:32:57.619
Yeah, so absolutely we, we love engagement from the community.

00:32:57.619 --> 00:32:59.989
I think that what I always tell people.

00:32:59.989 --> 00:33:05.277
First and foremost even though I'm sure Brady wants me to plug the testing program I want you to call our office and report anything that you see.

00:33:05.277 --> 00:33:09.455
If it's happening to you, if it's happening to somebody else, you can report anonymously.

00:33:09.455 --> 00:33:13.829
But we want people.

00:33:13.829 --> 00:33:16.097
You don't even have to be the one who's being discriminated against?

00:33:16.117 --> 00:33:16.539
absolutely not.

00:33:16.539 --> 00:33:22.359
That's part of your charter is to investigate, no matter what.

00:33:22.359 --> 00:33:30.015
Yes, how do people know your phone number and that you even exist?

00:33:30.015 --> 00:33:31.278
Yeah, so that's a big part of our outreach program.

00:33:31.278 --> 00:33:31.318
I.

00:33:31.861 --> 00:33:33.309
I joined again about a year and a half ago.

00:33:33.309 --> 00:33:43.810
So we are kind of trying to expand our outreach and get out in the community more so that we can have this public facing Person that will be promoting and letting people know that we exist.

00:33:43.810 --> 00:33:59.160
We have a very active social media that we Share all kinds of housing related to housing Information that's going on locally, nationally, just housing issues across the board, so people can interact with us on there.

00:33:59.160 --> 00:34:02.039
Our website is extremely well visited.

00:34:02.039 --> 00:34:07.720
We have an amazing education page that goes through all the different protected classes and very specific issues.

00:34:07.720 --> 00:34:17.038
We have publications on there that people can access in multiple different languages in many cases, and so they can find our contact information on there if they're interested as well.

00:34:17.038 --> 00:34:21.358
But yeah, outreach is something that we're really trying to ramp up.

00:34:21.762 --> 00:34:23.539
I go to a lot of different community events.

00:34:23.539 --> 00:34:27.358
We're always willing to go and talk to different groups of people who want to learn about their fair housing rights.

00:34:27.358 --> 00:34:31.775
They can contact us, request a presentation.

00:34:31.775 --> 00:34:34.938
I have a really hard time saying no to do it, so we'll probably make it work.

00:34:37.606 --> 00:34:55.713
But we, we want to talk about fair housing with anybody who wants to listen so, as you know this, a large part of the audience of this podcast are those who are already working within the continuum of care for the, for those who are experiencing homelessness.

00:34:55.713 --> 00:35:07.646
I just got to believe that there's needs to be, if there's not already, a strong connection Between them because they hear stories.

00:35:07.646 --> 00:35:18.387
I got to think, from what I've heard Every day of someone who's been evicted for maybe something that doesn't seem right, or Does that connection already exist?

00:35:18.387 --> 00:35:20.552
Are you looking to build that connection?

00:35:21.099 --> 00:35:35.052
Yeah, so I don't know about before I got here, but I did speak at the continuum of care IHCDA conference last year Um on fair housing basics, so I covered all seven protected classes, um, and it was really well received.

00:35:35.052 --> 00:35:36.061
Um.

00:35:36.061 --> 00:35:45.333
And since then I've kind of been working with IHCDA a little bit on a couple of of task force committees, kind of trying to make sure that we are educating the continuum of care on fair housing rights.

00:35:45.333 --> 00:35:55.855
As you mentioned, though, the continuum of care, people are working more directly with individuals, and so it's so key to educate those individuals so that they know that these rights exist.

00:35:55.855 --> 00:36:01.768
So if someone one of their clients does come to them and they're experiencing issues they can be like, oh there's this organization that can help you.

00:36:01.768 --> 00:36:15.793
And so building that network, like educating Um individuals and empowering them to activate their civil rights, is one part of it, but even educating advocates and social workers and the people on the ground with individuals is equally important.

00:36:17.215 --> 00:36:23.480
Based on what you said, it doesn't even have to be the person who's discriminated against to call those case.

00:36:23.480 --> 00:36:25.715
Workers could potentially give you a call.

00:36:26.376 --> 00:36:26.838
Absolutely.

00:36:26.838 --> 00:36:28.963
We just want to know what they know.

00:36:29.855 --> 00:36:34.407
Other ways people can get involved with your organization.

00:36:35.356 --> 00:36:40.226
I will let Erica jump in and talk about for Housing Month celebrations that we'll be doing here.

00:36:40.226 --> 00:36:47.735
The one thing that I just want the general public to do is step outside of their house and look around at your neighbors.

00:36:47.735 --> 00:36:49.280
Does everyone look like you?

00:36:49.280 --> 00:36:51.349
Does everyone love like you?

00:36:51.349 --> 00:36:52.735
Does everyone have the same abilities as you?

00:36:52.735 --> 00:36:56.735
If that's the case for housing, it's not alive and well in your community.

00:36:56.735 --> 00:37:02.186
We want to see a diverse, thriving community where people do not look like you, do not speak like you.

00:37:02.186 --> 00:37:10.168
If there is the same demographics in your community, ask yourself why.

00:37:10.168 --> 00:37:12.139
Learn about your history.

00:37:12.139 --> 00:37:14.284
Have you always had a segregated neighborhood?

00:37:14.284 --> 00:37:19.206
Are you in a formerly red-lined neighborhood?

00:37:20.235 --> 00:37:34.286
One of the ways that we help educate people on that is through a traveling exhibit that we do on the history of sales and lending discrimination here in Indianapolis that travels once a month to random places around Central Indiana.

00:37:34.286 --> 00:37:38.043
You can learn more where it's at on our events page on our website.

00:37:38.043 --> 00:37:56.735
I think a really great way is we all have to start taking changes and steps to redressing and eliminating the harmful decades of discrimination that took place many times, often mandated by the federal government, before the Civil Rights Act was passed.

00:37:56.735 --> 00:38:03.507
We have this great tool moving forward, but it does not do anything to go back in time to stop the discrimination.

00:38:03.507 --> 00:38:08.606
Our office is very well aware of that, especially in the lending market.

00:38:08.606 --> 00:38:12.735
We are taking steps to go out and find the discrimination ourselves.

00:38:12.735 --> 00:38:14.715
We're not waiting for people to call us.

00:38:15.402 --> 00:38:19.061
We go out and look at the trends Are you only lending to black people?

00:38:19.061 --> 00:38:20.646
Are you only lending to white people?

00:38:20.646 --> 00:38:27.534
We have really great reports that analyze our top 50 performing lenders in the Marion County area.

00:38:27.534 --> 00:38:38.349
We analyze criminal history behaviors with the improvements and the interconnection with more technology in our housing industry.

00:38:38.349 --> 00:38:42.273
We have concerns that algorithms are also biased.

00:38:42.273 --> 00:38:49.635
If they're created by someone that looks like a cisgendered, straight white man, it's most likely going to produce results that look like or that favor that.

00:38:49.635 --> 00:38:56.735
There are so many ways that people can get involved and everyone at any point in their life is somehow involved in housing.

00:38:56.735 --> 00:39:05.715
If you're in your church, if you are in you, work with someone that's a real estate agent, a broker, anything like that Help them spread the message of fair housing.

00:39:05.715 --> 00:39:08.735
Just a simple conversation or sharing our website with them.

00:39:08.735 --> 00:39:11.735
Everyone knows someone that's involved in the housing industry.

00:39:11.735 --> 00:39:16.226
That's a simple way that everyone can help us further a mission.

00:39:17.597 --> 00:39:20.844
We do offer free trainings, probably half the year.

00:39:20.844 --> 00:39:27.326
Almost every month we take a little bit of break here leading up to Fair Housing Month, but they'll start up in the summer again.

00:39:27.326 --> 00:39:29.735
They're virtual so you can attend from anywhere.

00:39:29.735 --> 00:39:31.715
Two hours for basics.

00:39:31.715 --> 00:39:36.367
We do have disability specific presentation as well for two hours and then some special topics.

00:39:36.367 --> 00:39:38.340
We love for people to attend.

00:39:38.340 --> 00:39:39.722
They're open to anybody and everybody.

00:39:39.722 --> 00:39:40.666
You do have to register.

00:39:40.666 --> 00:39:45.125
It's a great way to learn and to spread the word.

00:39:45.125 --> 00:39:52.327
If you know somebody who works in housing, like Brady said, it's a great opportunity to get that first introduction into Fair Housing if you're not familiar.

00:39:53.737 --> 00:39:56.324
In those cases, go to your website.

00:39:57.476 --> 00:40:02.487
Our events page will detail out our entire training schedule once we publish it for the year.

00:40:02.487 --> 00:40:05.695
It'll also tell you about any upcoming events we have.

00:40:05.695 --> 00:40:11.500
It'll tell you the location of our traveling exhibit, which, if anybody has a location that they want to host it, they can reach out to me personally.

00:40:11.500 --> 00:40:13.224
I will give you my information, Steve.

00:40:13.224 --> 00:40:15.523
We're always looking for locations.

00:40:15.523 --> 00:40:17.715
We just want it's completely localized.

00:40:17.715 --> 00:40:20.362
So it's all Indianapolis stories.

00:40:22.096 --> 00:40:28.606
It is going through the suburbs right now, which is super exciting because Indianapolis' story is the suburb story.

00:40:28.606 --> 00:40:35.735
In a lot of ways they're very interconnected and so we travel outside of Marion County with that exhibit as well.

00:40:35.735 --> 00:40:38.983
It stays the whole month and it gets a whole new audience of people.

00:40:38.983 --> 00:40:41.701
It's really exciting to get that history out there.

00:40:41.701 --> 00:40:48.715
It does go into modern day forms of discrimination as well as health impacts that we're seeing because of that discrimination.

00:40:48.715 --> 00:40:54.568
It's a great exhibit and definitely contact me if you would like to host it.

00:40:54.568 --> 00:40:59.606
We have a couple of locations but we have the rest of the year open.

00:40:59.606 --> 00:41:02.443
I'm definitely looking for new hosts if anybody is interested.

00:41:03.994 --> 00:41:09.606
Erica Brady alluded to Fair Housing Month coming up.

00:41:09.606 --> 00:41:14.965
Yes, I wanted to give you the opportunity, what's behind that and what happens.

00:41:16.356 --> 00:41:21.735
The Federal Fair Housing Act was passed as part of the Civil Rights Movement in 1968.

00:41:21.735 --> 00:41:28.505
It actually was a direct result of, unfortunately, the assassination of Dr Martin Luther King Jr.

00:41:28.505 --> 00:41:34.585
We celebrate April as Fair Housing Month as a result of that.

00:41:34.585 --> 00:41:44.268
Every year we at the Fair Housing Center rally our efforts a little bit extra when it comes to education and outreach.

00:41:44.268 --> 00:41:47.563
This year we have our Fair Housing Conference.

00:41:47.563 --> 00:41:48.838
We do that annually.

00:41:48.838 --> 00:41:50.101
This is our 12th conference.

00:41:50.101 --> 00:41:51.686
We're super excited about it.

00:41:51.686 --> 00:41:53.079
It's going to be on Tuesday, april 9th.

00:41:53.079 --> 00:41:57.192
It is an all-day Fair Housing Education.

00:41:57.192 --> 00:42:03.728
We have a basics track which will go through rental discrimination and all the different protected classes.

00:42:03.728 --> 00:42:06.735
We have a sales and lending track and we have a hot topics track.

00:42:06.735 --> 00:42:14.001
We have speakers from basically all over the country, hopefully National expertise yeah some of them are still confirming.

00:42:14.262 --> 00:42:14.463
Yes.

00:42:15.317 --> 00:42:16.141
You get expertise.

00:42:16.141 --> 00:42:19.474
That isn't just Amy and Brady and I talking to you about.

00:42:19.494 --> 00:42:23.735
Fair Housing which is what a lot of our trainings are, because we know that and we're doing that.

00:42:23.735 --> 00:42:30.422
But we're bringing in outside people to share the same information in different ways, to share their own experiences.

00:42:30.422 --> 00:42:34.715
It's really a great experience and it's virtual so people can attend.

00:42:34.715 --> 00:42:40.688
We've had tons of people from Indiana attend, but we also have some people from outside of Indiana attend.

00:42:40.688 --> 00:42:44.483
It's going to be a great experience so people can look for that on our events page.

00:42:44.483 --> 00:42:50.735
Coming soon we also will be releasing a children's book this year that we're really excited about.

00:42:51.539 --> 00:42:57.543
We've partnered with a local author which I'm not sure I'm allowed to say, so I'm not going to say her name, but we're super excited.

00:42:57.543 --> 00:42:59.643
It's a kids book.

00:42:59.643 --> 00:43:02.690
It's illustrated in the most beautiful colors that I've like.

00:43:02.690 --> 00:43:06.282
I'm just super excited about it, and it's for ages 8 to 10.

00:43:06.282 --> 00:43:18.715
And basically it's about the story of this biracial boy and his family and they're forced to move because of circumstances in their family good circumstances but moving is tough on children.

00:43:18.715 --> 00:43:34.387
It can be really scary, and so it's about you know walking through that fear and why he's scared and what he's scared of, and at the end of it it's about coming into this neighborhood that really embraces diversity.

00:43:34.387 --> 00:43:43.601
It's not just about accepting that somebody is different than you, it's embracing it fully and celebrating that diversity, and so we're really excited about that.

00:43:44.096 --> 00:43:49.735
We're really excited about having a local author write it for us and with us, and this has been a year in the making, I think.

00:43:49.735 --> 00:43:59.655
So we'll be releasing that in April, hopefully as well, so you guys can be on the lookout for that, but we do a lot of presentations throughout April and a lot of different things.

00:43:59.655 --> 00:44:01.900
So, yeah, I'm pretty excited.

00:44:01.900 --> 00:44:03.105
Brady, did I miss anything?

00:44:04.036 --> 00:44:05.643
Yeah, I just I would add reports.

00:44:05.643 --> 00:44:09.505
So we are really happy with the reports that we put out.

00:44:09.505 --> 00:44:25.735
We produce reports by advocates for the general public, so oftentimes you'll go online and search housing reports and it's always from the lenders perspective or real estate perspective, and so we wanted to get reports and knowledge into the hands of people that are most impacted by the discrimination.

00:44:26.277 --> 00:44:30.735
So we'll be having, I think, at least four reports coming out in the next five or six months or so.

00:44:30.735 --> 00:44:49.731
So please visit our website for that as well, just because we have so many different types of topics and especially for individuals involved in the continuum of care, lots of different ways and concerning areas that might have a direct or an indirect impact on discrimination that their clients are experiencing.

00:44:49.894 --> 00:44:53.184
So what kinds of information would be in a report?

00:44:53.894 --> 00:45:04.409
So we will be releasing an updated report on the top 50 lenders in Marion County and who they are producing loans to.

00:45:04.409 --> 00:45:16.735
We analyze him to data and we will, you know, call the top 50 and see who's performing the best and the worst when I say best, within air quotations compared to their peers of the national average.

00:45:16.735 --> 00:45:18.501
So we'll have that report coming out.

00:45:18.501 --> 00:45:33.231
We have had some reports on out of state investors and the havoc that they're wreaking on first time home buyers, especially black and brown communities, going in and just taking any way of first time home ownership opportunities away from these people.

00:45:33.231 --> 00:45:35.735
We have had stuff on tenant screening.

00:45:35.735 --> 00:45:45.561
So the impact on evictions, the impact on the effects of individuals with incarceration records, I do want to know.

00:45:45.561 --> 00:45:46.282
Sorry, right.

00:45:47.516 --> 00:45:48.157
I do want to know.

00:45:48.157 --> 00:45:52.387
There are some gaps in the protections that we feel at the Fair Housing Center federally.

00:45:52.387 --> 00:45:57.695
So in some states I remedied that by adding local protections, but Indiana has not.

00:45:57.695 --> 00:45:59.320
Am I allowed to say that?

00:45:59.599 --> 00:46:00.202
Yeah, okay.

00:46:02.396 --> 00:46:14.050
So we really see a lot of issues when it comes to criminal history and that being used against people and really being a huge barrier to people who are exiting our criminal legal system.

00:46:14.050 --> 00:46:39.177
We also see a huge problem with source of income discrimination when it comes to what it's usually called Section 8, but it's housing choice vouchers now and we technically have protections for our LGBTQ community because of an executive order and updated HUD guidance, but that's not actually an official amendment into the Fair Housing Act, so we would like to see some of those added protections.

00:46:39.800 --> 00:46:52.016
So we're not saying the Fair Housing Act as it stands, it protects everybody but, it is a very powerful tool to protect all of us in one way or another, even if there are those few little gaps we'd still like to see closed.

00:46:54.465 --> 00:47:01.009
You guys both speak with much passion and I really appreciate that.

00:47:01.009 --> 00:47:02.992
What motivated you guys?

00:47:02.992 --> 00:47:06.425
What's your story as to how you ended up where you are?

00:47:07.708 --> 00:47:08.449
I can share first.

00:47:08.449 --> 00:47:30.114
So I studied non-profit management with the focus in the arts in undergrad and very quickly realized that I had this passion that was just not fully satisfied by interning with arts agencies and so I really grasped onto social justice and kind of those more philanthropic efforts for a little bit out of after graduating.

00:47:30.114 --> 00:48:07.431
But personally I've always had this fire inside me because I did grow up gay in a very conservative, very Catholic focused community that was not always the most accepting, and so I have been in people's shoes that are experiencing discrimination and I can understand what they're going through, the traumas, the grievances, excuse me, and the ways that you react to those types of things, and so being able to relate to people that are going through what you are serving and who you're helping is so incredibly important.

00:48:07.431 --> 00:48:24.436
But I got into this because of the civil rights justice aspect but since being involved with this for the last 10 years, housing is everything, so you can't get away from anything without always getting back to housing and where you live.

00:48:24.436 --> 00:48:28.893
So we have incredible stats related to health and housing.

00:48:28.893 --> 00:48:39.655
So here in Indianapolis, depending on if you were born in a majority black census district versus a majority white, you might live 17 years longer if you're in the white neighborhood compared to the black neighborhood.

00:48:39.655 --> 00:48:42.588
Those statistics no one should be okay with.

00:48:42.588 --> 00:48:47.686
That's 17 years of someone's life, that you get to live longer because just because you're born.

00:48:47.686 --> 00:48:51.853
And so my passion ignites very much.

00:48:51.914 --> 00:49:01.090
So doing this work, because the inequities, while not as blatant so we're not going to rent to you because you're black that still happens, unfortunately, but it's not as common.

00:49:01.090 --> 00:49:07.829
Discrimination is getting a lot trickier to prove, but that doesn't mean it's any less more harm.

00:49:07.829 --> 00:49:13.630
Less or, excuse me, does not mean that it's more harmful as a result, even though it's not as in your face.

00:49:13.630 --> 00:49:29.286
And so evictions, this tenant, screening, criminal history, source of income, discrimination, these out of state investors, they are all in some way, shape or form adding to the discrimination that's happening and the inequities in our communities.

00:49:29.286 --> 00:49:43.909
And so once you realize how important housing is, the passion is very hard to subside right, and once you get involved with it, it's so incredibly important to realize that the work is just beginning.

00:49:43.909 --> 00:50:02.420
We went how many years and decades and centuries through slavery, and only in the last hundreds or years have we actually gotten to a point where black people are not seen as slaves, and I say that loosely to some people but we have so much work to do.

00:50:02.505 --> 00:50:13.018
we're still in the very beginning stages of actually enforcing civil rights tools and we have a long way to go, and that's why I'm really excited to continue fighting in the industry.

00:50:13.425 --> 00:50:17.826
Does it surprise you at all that when you actually think about how long the Fair Housing Act has been around?

00:50:17.826 --> 00:50:24.161
I'm sorry, my lead asked questions when I started working here.

00:50:24.161 --> 00:50:27.309
I did not have Brady's long story to get here.

00:50:27.309 --> 00:50:29.617
Mine was completely different, which I'll share in a bit.

00:50:29.617 --> 00:50:40.956
But when I thought about the Fair Housing Act passing in 1968, that's within my parents' timeline, like that's it's crazy to me to think of that.

00:50:41.077 --> 00:50:42.621
Yeah, it's been that long.

00:50:43.242 --> 00:50:45.489
I think it's been that short it's been that short yeah.

00:50:45.668 --> 00:50:47.092
Oh it's both perspectives.

00:50:47.152 --> 00:50:51.610
Yeah, it's both perspectives we just recently did it yes.

00:50:51.610 --> 00:50:57.123
But yet it's been how many years and we're still here.

00:50:57.143 --> 00:51:11.452
The work is just beginning it's not that long ago, which we I can't even fathom, but we're also still have all these issues and I can't tell you how many times some of the hardest things I have to do at an event is.

00:51:11.452 --> 00:51:13.545
Somebody comes out to me and they're like oh, this doesn't happen to me.

00:51:13.545 --> 00:51:14.206
And I'm looking at them.

00:51:14.206 --> 00:51:32.289
I was like I hate to break it to you, but it could be like people think that discrimination is a civil rights 1960s problem just because it's hidden, or it's more disguised now.

00:51:32.309 --> 00:51:46.835
Yeah, it's more described because we don't have the water fountains that say white and black over them, right, and that doesn't mean, like Brady said, that it's any less harmful, but it is a heck of a lot harder to uncover and prove.

00:51:47.297 --> 00:52:02.621
I think one thing I want to say is, if you ever go to DC and you haven't been to the African American History Museum, it is so incredible because you walk through most of the floors and you work your way up and only until the very last snippet of that exhibit in that museum is where our current day is.

00:52:02.621 --> 00:52:16.487
And so to kind of shine a light on Erica's thing is look at how much history we have that's influencing how our neighborhoods are so segregated now, and only that little snippet at that last second there do you actually see the advancements that we've been making.

00:52:16.487 --> 00:52:24.088
So yeah, it's a great way to actually be physically in the timeline of how really see it right there in their face.

00:52:24.128 --> 00:52:29.018
So the timeline yeah, erica, tell me a little bit.

00:52:29.666 --> 00:52:32.052
So you're about to get a black and white comparison here.

00:52:32.052 --> 00:52:39.110
I actually started off and I went to school for something absolutely unrelated to what I'm doing now.

00:52:39.110 --> 00:52:52.266
I started off my first career in a very technical, very scientific, mathematical career in a for-profit business and there was nothing wrong with that.

00:52:52.266 --> 00:52:56.817
I really enjoyed it for a while and it really did tailor to a lot of my skills.

00:52:56.817 --> 00:53:12.990
But and I think this is kind of an old story now, but at the time it seemed pretty substantial is like COVID hit and we were all driven home and we're all sitting at home with nothing but ourselves to occupy our minds.

00:53:13.532 --> 00:53:13.813
Yes.

00:53:14.173 --> 00:53:17.864
Right, and so you're driven to like internal reflection on your life.

00:53:17.864 --> 00:53:25.530
And I was able to work from home, so I was not impacted like many others were during the pandemic, so I was fortunate in that way.

00:53:25.530 --> 00:53:31.192
But it did slow everything down, right, we weren't constantly going places, constantly busy.

00:53:31.192 --> 00:53:46.059
So you had this reflection time and I just and up until that point I had been involved in different nonprofits and housing and it had been like passion projects for me outside of work, but I hadn't done anything as a career in that in that way.

00:53:46.059 --> 00:53:58.039
So I just, I just was at home with myself thinking is this really what I want to be doing for the rest of my life, which there's nothing wrong with that but I wasn't feeling fulfilled for myself.

00:53:58.059 --> 00:54:24.275
So I was looking for a change and a couple of years later I was like ready to make that change and I was looking for organizations here in Indie that were working in this nonprofit quote unquote affordable housing, housing realm and I landed here and it has been an incredible journey and it has opened my eyes even more.

00:54:24.275 --> 00:54:46.476
I think COVID there were so many terrible things going on during COVID, but I think one of the positive things that happened was just how, in your face, the housing issues were for people, and so I think that that really helped inspire me to like make that leap, because it was not an easy decision and I am not really a risk taker.

00:54:46.476 --> 00:54:52.731
I don't think I don't do anything drastic without thinking through it, like 100 different ways.

00:54:53.253 --> 00:54:54.958
You're scientific, exactly.

00:54:56.764 --> 00:55:07.882
But I just decided that it you know it's now or never, I could not do it, and 20 years down the line either regret it or it might be too late or something, and I can always go back.

00:55:07.882 --> 00:55:08.545
I don't.

00:55:08.545 --> 00:55:11.612
I haven't lost any of the knowledge or skills I had before.

00:55:11.612 --> 00:55:14.777
I'm just using different ones now, but that's how I ended up here.

00:55:14.777 --> 00:55:17.454
I just kind of looked at local organizations.

00:55:17.596 --> 00:55:20.992
I loved the work that the FHCCI does.

00:55:20.992 --> 00:55:28.193
I love the reports that they issue and I love that, yes, they serve and help people who are facing housing discrimination.

00:55:28.193 --> 00:55:57.362
But Amy's really good at at pulling in all kinds of housing issues under housing discrimination because, even though it may not look on the surface like like something that is a violation of fair housing, we know that the majority of housing issues, at the end of the day, end up impacting people of color, people of low socioeconomic standing, people with disabilities and women significantly more, and so it's just it's.

00:55:57.362 --> 00:55:58.644
It's really great.

00:55:58.644 --> 00:56:01.190
I feel very lucky to be here.

00:56:01.190 --> 00:56:13.206
I'm not sure how I was chosen, to be honest, but I feel incredibly lucky and proud to be working for this organization, and I'm going to stop now because I feel like I'm getting emotional.

00:56:13.206 --> 00:56:14.389
Okay.

00:56:16.092 --> 00:56:20.826
Well, I just want to say thank you so much to both of you for the work you're doing.

00:56:21.505 --> 00:56:22.728
Thank you so much, Steve, for having us.

00:56:23.088 --> 00:56:24.610
Yeah, thank you, we appreciate it.